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  1. #41
    Senior Member Rank = Kyusai Rapleyr's Avatar
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    Just noticed a big error in my initial pond build....no shut off valve on the 110mm pipe to the sieve.

    Either need to seriously drain the pond down or cut the pipe and get wet and put a valve on....which I doubt is possible.


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  3. #42
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Adult Champion NickK-UK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rapleyr View Post
    Just noticed a big error in my initial pond build....no shut off valve on the 110mm pipe to the sieve.

    Either need to seriously drain the pond down or cut the pipe and get wet and put a valve on....which I doubt is possible.

    The flow rate of 4" tubes is massive. You may want a dome with a rubber seal on the base to put over the bottom drain - the water pressure will then attempt to push down on it and it should then cut off the water flow. Then cut and fit the valve (check there's no flow first) as that may be the best way.

    You could also put a piece of straight 4" on the top of the valve, refit and the maximum amount of water will be in the tube up to water level. Once the valve is fitted - turn off and then fit the filter connection.

    I doubt you'd get the valve on without something cutting flow, let alone get it seated right.

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  5. #43
    Senior Member Rank = Kyusai Rapleyr's Avatar
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    Looking at options now for a bung it a few paddling pools!!!


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  7. #44
    Senior Member Rank = Nanasai Handy Kenny's Avatar
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    Rapleyr,

    Heres a thought, cut the flow from the bottom drain as much as is possible. A large bath sheet stuffed up the 4" pipe at the bottom drain end would work if you can get someone to go in the water and dismantle the BD otherwise cover over the top of the BD. Alternatively purchase a 4 inch rubber boot or two (Flexseal DC115 is the best) and preconnect your on/off valve to the Flexseal. Solvent is not going to work with all the water around. Accept that you are going to lose some water when you cut the 4 inch pipe so have everything to hand. A 4 inch pipe can easily flow with 1100 litres of water a minute under gravity. Cut the pipe and you could then stuff another bath sheet in the open end, to further cut the flow. Fit the Flexseal rubber boot and on/off valve (make sure the valve is in the off position) and tighten everything up by hand. Before you connect up the other side of the valve open it and reach in and pull through the bath sheet.

    Kenny

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  9. #45
    Senior Member Rank = Kyusai Rapleyr's Avatar
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    That is the plan I have come up with. If it all goes to pot then tsunami down the path!!!


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  11. #46
    Senior Member Rank = Kyusai Rapleyr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by john1 View Post
    You could put a T before the drum one for the wash and one for top up.
    Is the water supply hard plumbed in or hose pipe?
    If plumbed in I would fit isolator valves on each supply for easy maintenance.

    Would definitely go for the 25,my pond isnt much bigger than 12000 ltrs at 3000 gals and that has a Draco 25 working great.
    Manufacturers figures arnt allways right as you may well know.
    If I read correctly...you use the waste tray outlet as your trickle out and just added a trickle in. So When I install the drum I want to have the pond at the correct level with the water just on the waste shute?? Is there any adjustments in the drum or do I have to get the drum mm perfect?


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  13. #47
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Adult Champion NickK-UK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rapleyr View Post
    If I read correctly...you use the waste tray outlet as your trickle out and just added a trickle in. So When I install the drum I want to have the pond at the correct level with the water just on the waste shute?? Is there any adjustments in the drum or do I have to get the drum mm perfect?


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    As yours is gravity fed, it should be safe to put the water level and use the waste chute as a pond overflow (it also cleans and keeps the waste clear!).

    The only time when this would cause a problem is flushing the BD line. Switching off the BD valve and letting the pump drop the water level drop before opening the valve. The inflow surge may overflow but that will be dirty water. The danger for doing this is that it puts a lot of water pressure on the drum mesh and may tear it. I intend to have an open BD line (the BD line sweeps 90 degrees to the drum inlets) and that allows a long 1-2in pipe to be inserted and vacuum out the settled mess instead with less stress on the drum.

    This is the 16 but similar. They have the water level up close. The waste acts as an overflow before the bio overflows which is neat design feature.

    solum16-complete.png


    The new pond build will be gravity fed too

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  15. #48
    Senior Member Rank = Kyusai Rapleyr's Avatar
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    Draco Solum 25 drum

    Got it all plumbed in and when I opened the valves the water level sat right at the top of the waste tray as planned......but the drum has not done a single wash unless i force it by moving the sensor.

    The water level has now dropped on both the clean and dirty side lower than the pond level and if I press the manual wash button nothing happens.

    Reading the instructions it suggests the umbilical is plugged in wrong but I have checked it three times and all it lines up perfectly

    So frustrating to do all the hard work and then not be able to work out the issue!!!


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    Last edited by Rapleyr; 25-04-2020 at 09:10 PM.

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  17. #49
    Senior Member Rank = Kyusai Rapleyr's Avatar
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    All sorted.....I had the pumps too high so there was too much flow. Reduced both pumps to 85% and works fine now.

    Back to being happy with the switch!!!!


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  19. #50
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Adult Champion NickK-UK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rapleyr View Post
    Got it all plumbed in and when I opened the valves the water level sat right at the top of the waste tray as planned......but the drum has not done a single wash unless i force it by moving the sensor.

    The water level has now dropped on both the clean and dirty side lower than the pond level and if I press the manual wash button nothing happens.

    Reading the instructions it suggests the umbilical is plugged in wrong but I have checked it three times and all it lines up perfectly

    So frustrating to do all the hard work and then not be able to work out the issue!!!


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    If the water level has dropped below water level on the clean side that sounds like something is not right on the BD supply or the water is being pulled fast?

    Which side is the sensor? Is the sensor float pointing up or pointing down? Just incase you have the wrong sensor (ie pump fed on a gravity system).

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  21. #51
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Adult Champion NickK-UK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rapleyr View Post
    All sorted.....I had the pumps too high so there was too much flow. Reduced both pumps to 85% and works fine now.

    Back to being happy with the switch!!!!


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    Ahh

    That's good news - what rate are you getting through the drum?

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  23. #52
    Senior Member Rank = Kyusai Rapleyr's Avatar
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    I am using a 20k and 10k vario. I reduced them both to 85% and it seems ok. I have heard it go off once so that’s a good sign

    Do you have a trickle in/out? My only option is to have mine in the drum as the rest is bead, moving bed and shower so not level with the pond.

    I was thinking tank connector with flexi to waste now I know my levels are good I can cut into it.....although seems strange buying something and cutting a great big hole in it!!!!


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  25. #53
    Senior Member Rank = Kyusai Rapleyr's Avatar
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    Also very glad I went with the Solum due to size, I literally have 15mm spare length wise so lucky I measured more than once to make sure!


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  27. #54
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Adult Champion NickK-UK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rapleyr View Post
    I am using a 20k and 10k vario. I reduced them both to 85% and it seems ok. I have heard it go off once so that’s a good sign

    Do you have a trickle in/out? My only option is to have mine in the drum as the rest is bead, moving bed and shower so not level with the pond.

    I was thinking tank connector with flexi to waste now I know my levels are good I can cut into it.....although seems strange buying something and cutting a great big hole in it!!!!


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    At 85% about 25,000lph on paper and the Draco 25 being a 25,000lph rated drum makes sense - it is a 58 micron mesh version I take it? If any additional issues in flow one option could be to simply get a 70 micron sheet and replace it on the existing drum.

    I don't have a trickle in/out at the moment but this is one thing I will be looking at - the drum provides a level overflow (the waste) but what I don't want is a slow trickle in that for two reasons (a) a slow trickle of water would promote a bio mass/algae and (b) in winter a trickle could result in layers of freezing eventually blocking the drum (although if it was that cold in the drum it would probably freeze the spray nozzles).

    I was considering the Draco Skimmer - this has an inbuilt overflow but it's 740mm long (I don't have back space around the pond for that). It's flow rate of 8-10,000lph which, on a 10,000l pond and as a floating weir thus needs that rate to really operate properly - a 3" outlet from that to the Draco via a ball valve to switch on/off. It could be used to introduce water but I think something on top of the bottom drain riser may be the option - perhaps T junction off just above the filter feed then into it's own separate 4" vertical pipe (so the high is kept low). I want a wall skimmer but not decided on which yet (always good to have two inlets in case the BD has problems) if this sits on the back wall then it would further compound space issues.

    Like you I'll be short of space for the filter and down to the centimeter. The blocks for the filter pit will be end-on so the wall will be 10cm plus insulation (the pond wall will be 21mm). I think a task today will be to design the filter pit in more detail.

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  29. #55
    Senior Member Rank = Kyusai Rapleyr's Avatar
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    I had to jig a few things around and shorten some of the original pipework but all went in thankfully. Will have a good look today at the drum and get an understanding of how it works for the overflow as I didn’t finish until late last night.

    Good luck with yours


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  31. #56
    Senior Member Rank = Kyusai Rapleyr's Avatar
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    Draco Solum 25 drum

    I am struggling with running heights. I have a 20k vario running around 80% and 10k pump running at 75% but I have to have the float switch at its lowest level unless I get an error as the water isn’t suffice t to lift the switch back up.

    Running 4 inch from bottom drain and 2 inch from skimmer but if I increase the 2 inch to 3 or 4 for more water incoming I do t think this will help due to the maximum flow rate of the drum???


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  32. #57
    Senior Member Rank = Adult Champion Twhitenosugar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rapleyr View Post
    I am struggling with running heights. I have a 20k vario running around 80% and 10k pump running at 75% but I have to have the float switch at its lowest level unless I get an error as the water isn’t suffice t to lift the switch back up.

    Running 4 inch from bottom drain and 2 inch from skimmer but if I increase the 2 inch to 3 or 4 for more water incoming I do t think this will help due to the maximum flow rate of the drum???


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I have a similar issue on a solum 16. My work around was just to undo the clamping nut that holds the float switch, I then dropped the switch so it's dangling underneath (but still upright) and then lightly clamped the cable with the clamping nut.

    This was meant to be a temporary measure to stop the drum cleaning too frequently, but I've ended up leaving it like that since November and it's worked fine.

    Initially I thought the float switch was not long enough, but its more likley I'm either trying to draw too much through it, it's getting bio film build up or a bit of both.

    Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk
    13,000L fibreglassed raised pond with window

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  34. #58
    Senior Member Rank = Kyusai Rapleyr's Avatar
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    Going that low with the switch does it allow a larger flow and work without giving an error?


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  36. #59
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Adult Champion NickK-UK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rapleyr View Post
    I am struggling with running heights. I have a 20k vario running around 80% and 10k pump running at 75% but I have to have the float switch at its lowest level unless I get an error as the water isn’t suffice t to lift the switch back up.

    Running 4 inch from bottom drain and 2 inch from skimmer but if I increase the 2 inch to 3 or 4 for more water incoming I do t think this will help due to the maximum flow rate of the drum???
    80% 20,000 = 16,000
    75% 10,000 = 7500
    Total 23,500 lph or 94% capacity Draco's Solum 25 manufacturer figures!

    You're probably maxing out the drum at 58microns once the drum gets dirty. An alternative option is switching out the mesh to a larger 68micron mesh is likely to give you more flow rate in the current setup.

    My rates vary - the Solum 16 at a rate of 5-6,000 with a mud pond, however once the level of muck is down to a daily amount then it can cope with more rate. How often is the drum cleaning atm?

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  38. #60
    Senior Member Rank = Adult Champion Twhitenosugar's Avatar
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    Well it means that the clean side can drop lower before the drum tries to clean. On a gravity system at least - which is what I have.

    So if its the flow rate that is causing the drum to clean too frequently, dropping the float switch is a way to keep the drum at that flow rate without it constantly trying to clean I.e. the intervals between cleans should increase as the water has further to drop before the float switch is triggered.

    You shouldn't really have to do that if operating within the given parameters of your drum.

    But if you do, the main downside to this is if you are trying to force a flow that is more than the drum was designed to handle, the higher water pressure on the mesh may cause more fines to get through.

    In terms of skimmer, I've got a wide mouth skimmer with a floating weir (not sure of brand). On that I've got a 3" pipe and with both bd and skimmer valves fully open, the skimmer really has decent flow on it - well so much that I normally operate my skimmer valve only 3/4 open to ensure sufficient flow from the bd.

    I can't see any downside to going from 2" to 3". It'll increase the overall flow into the drum and mean the skimmer can have increased draw, if you need it. And as long as you have a ball valve, you can always adjust It to how you need it. The only issue is you'll have to fork out for a 3" ball valve which are not exactly cheap.

    Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk
    13,000L fibreglassed raised pond with window

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