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  1. #1
    Senior Member Rank = Sansai ABN67's Avatar
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    First koi pond - planning stages

    Hi, as tiltled I'm currently in the planning stages of my first venture into the world of koi. I am going to be doing all the work myself (with help from the mrs) with the exception of the fiberglass which I'll get to later on.

    So the plan is block built half above/half below ground level 12' x 8' x 6' deep with a gazebo/pergola type roof.
    Things I have so far decided (subject to change pending further research and advice)
    Bottom drain - 4" spindrifter
    Nexus 220+
    2 x 2" underwater returns - placement to be decided after more research
    Skimmer which I'd like to be switchable via valve/plumbing between either a blade/waterfall/shower and the 3rd underwater return - unsure what to put between skimmer and return by way of filtration so suggestions very welcome.
    Filter house will be a combination of block and wood as an extension of the pond structure.
    The location will be along the length of my garden just after my decking so there will be a nice place to sit looking down over the pond (decking is raised)
    I will also be adding a window along the 12' length, I'm aiming for around 7' to 8' x 2.5' for the window.
    Liner vs Fiberglass I'd definitely prefer fiberglass but this is not a job I can do myself so will be searching for a recommendations when the time comes.
    all electrics, uv, pumps etc will be contained within the filter house so protected from the environment.
    Heating - possibly an option dependant on purchase/running costs - to be further researched and again suggestions and advice appreciated
    Trickle in/out to be included in the build, not yet decided on the cladding for the outer walls of the pond/filter house. I'm sure there is lots of things I have not yet thought about so any advice or suggestions extremely welcome.
    Starting to gather materials/equipment over the coming months with intention of breaking ground in springtime so just a few short months to finalize the plans and get everything together.
    As above any advice/suggestions will be gratefully received.

    Andy



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  3. #2
    Senior Member Rank = Jussai g mac's Avatar
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    Cost wise, I would budget for at least twice what you first estimate
    7500 litres
    Filtreau combi with uv.
    Some koi

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  5. #3
    Senior Member Rank = Sansai ABN67's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by g mac View Post
    Cost wise, I would budget for at least twice what you first estimate
    That's the same thing a friend of mine said when he built his pond a couple of years ago, doesn't matter how well its planned it will definitely go over budget ☺️

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  7. #4
    Senior Member Rank = Hassai Mike Bass's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ABN67 View Post
    Hi, as tiltled I'm currently in the planning stages of my first venture into the world of koi. I am going to be doing all the work myself (with help from the mrs) with the exception of the fiberglass which I'll get to later on.

    So the plan is block built half above/half below ground level 12' x 8' x 6' deep with a gazebo/pergola type roof.
    Things I have so far decided (subject to change pending further research and advice)
    Bottom drain - 4" spindrifter
    Nexus 220+
    2 x 2" underwater returns - placement to be decided after more research
    Skimmer which I'd like to be switchable via valve/plumbing between either a blade/waterfall/shower and the 3rd underwater return - unsure what to put between skimmer and return by way of filtration so suggestions very welcome.
    Filter house will be a combination of block and wood as an extension of the pond structure.
    The location will be along the length of my garden just after my decking so there will be a nice place to sit looking down over the pond (decking is raised)
    I will also be adding a window along the 12' length, I'm aiming for around 7' to 8' x 2.5' for the window.
    Liner vs Fiberglass I'd definitely prefer fiberglass but this is not a job I can do myself so will be searching for a recommendations when the time comes.
    all electrics, uv, pumps etc will be contained within the filter house so protected from the environment.
    Heating - possibly an option dependant on purchase/running costs - to be further researched and again suggestions and advice appreciated
    Trickle in/out to be included in the build, not yet decided on the cladding for the outer walls of the pond/filter house. I'm sure there is lots of things I have not yet thought about so any advice or suggestions extremely welcome.
    Starting to gather materials/equipment over the coming months with intention of breaking ground in springtime so just a few short months to finalize the plans and get everything together.
    As above any advice/suggestions will be gratefully received.

    Andy
    My pond is similar to your planned build 5m x 2.5m x 1.8m deep with 2x 4”spindrifter drains into Filtreau drum with built in bio chamber then split to bakki shower returning mainly back to bio chamber or ASHP. Then via 2x 2” underwater returns

    Skimmmer line goes from Cetus sieve to easypod split to UV & 2” underwater return at a tangent other end of pond or via reed bed & blade.


    3x 2” underwater returns & 2x blade returns ( 1 from shower & 1 from reed bed filter)
    6769547C-14E7-4651-BAAC-802A909EEBBF.jpg
    1CAD2EDE-3FE2-44CD-9ED1-6B949C8475A8.jpg03FA2A66-78C5-42F4-8A10-CEC7E9036C5B.jpg
    7DDFABF2-D405-4061-8D4D-EF79FA3FBBDB.jpg
    37E5B262-7D94-400C-A133-2EF20B486182.jpg
    58C90E7D-2659-44F0-A416-A3E0D189EC2F.jpg
    So far this is still living up to my planned expectations as my “forever” pond being big enough for my 27 or so fish (at least 8 over 50cm) I can reach all areas of the pond to catch fish if required and both windows and jump guards allow winter viewing when covers are on

    You are welcome, If you ever want to drive over to look for yourself from Birmingham is only an hour up the M42.
    1kGal BD/Skim RDF/UV/k1 2.3kGal 2windows 2airBD/skim Sieve/Eazypod RDFcombi+bakki 3xVP/UV,ASHP

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  9. #5
    Senior Member Rank = Sansai ABN67's Avatar
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    Hi Mike, that's a great looking set up you have, I hope mine turns out that nice. Did you do the work yourself ? I really can't wait to get started, the more I see the more enthusiastic I get. I love the red brick finish and the way you've continued the brickwork above the window. Thankyou for the very generous offer of an invite to see it in person, hopefully this can be arranged some time work commitments permitting.

    Andy

  10. #6
    Senior Member Rank = Hassai Mike Bass's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ABN67 View Post
    Hi Mike, that's a great looking set up you have, I hope mine turns out that nice. Did you do the work yourself ? I really can't wait to get started, the more I see the more enthusiastic I get. I love the red brick finish and the way you've continued the brickwork above the window. Thankyou for the very generous offer of an invite to see it in person, hopefully this can be arranged some time work commitments permitting.

    Andy
    The digging out was done with the help of my previous employers digger, the bottom drains & concrete slab was done by myself. The block work & fibreglassing was done by Stuart Boorman (Husband to owner of Japanese Water Gardens) All design & the rest of the plumbing and filter house was on my own. From planning to completion took four years ( including through lock downs) Still making finishing touches now.

    If you are able to find time just pm me even if just opinions or advice, you can never do too much research
    1kGal BD/Skim RDF/UV/k1 2.3kGal 2windows 2airBD/skim Sieve/Eazypod RDFcombi+bakki 3xVP/UV,ASHP

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  12. #7
    Senior Member Rank = Sansai ABN67's Avatar
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    It's definitely a huge project and I completely agree, research and planning is key, I'm so glad I came across this forum as there are so many knowledgeable people like yourself who have already completed the journey I'm just starting who are willing to offer their help and experience.

    You're very fortunate to have access to a digger, unfortunately for me due to lack of access I have to dig by hand, like you I'm intending to diy as much as I can to try and keep the costs down but there are some things I won't attempt, fiberglassing is top of my list for getting in a specialist so I may well be in touch with your fiberglasser when the time comes, I'm intending to do the concrete slab, blockwork and plumbing myself but I'm not really up to speed with the electrical side so that's going to be more research and a steep learning curve , yours really is a beautiful pond , I bet you've spent many hours through the warmer months enjoying your hard work making it all worthwhile

  13. #8
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion Ajm's Avatar
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    For access have you seen the micro diggers . Designed to go though door ways ect tracks go in to 900mm . And as for fiberglass message @kenalexander@blueyonder.c

    Done many many ponds for members on here with all 5* reviews for him his lads and the work

    Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
    Freddyboy the legend

    "we are water keepers first"

    Johnathan

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  15. #9
    Senior Member Rank = Sansai ABN67's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ajm View Post
    For access have you seen the micro diggers . Designed to go though door ways ect tracks go in to 900mm . And as for fiberglass message @kenalexander@blueyonder.c

    Done many many ponds for members on here with all 5* reviews for him his lads and the work

    Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
    Thankyou for the recommendation for a fiberglasser, I'll definitely call them for a quote when the time comes. Poor access so even a micro digger is a no go.

  16. #10
    Senior Member Rank = Sansai ABN67's Avatar
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    Hope this isn't a daft question but I'm unsure so best to ask, I intend to fit a skimmer to the wall of my pond (when I get started) it is my understanding that I can have the skimmer gravity fed through a 4" pipe to some mechanical filtration eg a cetus sieve then pumped back to pond with the pump fitted after the sieve with pipe work leading to either underwater feed or blade/shower/waterfall so my question is would the flow of water coming from the gravity fed skimmer and through the sieve be able to keep up with the pump if it was being operated at a medium to high flow rate of say 10k to 15k lph or is that too much flow, I also intend to run a 4" bd to a nexus 220 but it is my understanding that these are best run at around 5k to 6k lph hence the reason for not wanting to run the skimmer through the nexus, does this seem like the correct way to set this up or have I missed the mark completely.

    Thanks Andy

  17. #11
    Senior Member Rank = Hassai Mike Bass's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ABN67 View Post
    Hope this isn't a daft question but I'm unsure so best to ask, I intend to fit a skimmer to the wall of my pond (when I get started) it is my understanding that I can have the skimmer gravity fed through a 4" pipe to some mechanical filtration eg a cetus sieve then pumped back to pond with the pump fitted after the sieve with pipe work leading to either underwater feed or blade/shower/waterfall so my question is would the flow of water coming from the gravity fed skimmer and through the sieve be able to keep up with the pump if it was being operated at a medium to high flow rate of say 10k to 15k lph or is that too much flow, I also intend to run a 4" bd to a nexus 220 but it is my understanding that these are best run at around 5k to 6k lph hence the reason for not wanting to run the skimmer through the nexus, does this seem like the correct way to set this up or have I missed the mark completely.

    Thanks Andy
    Never a daft question if you’re not sure. ASK
    My wide mouth Oase skimmer with 4” pipework down to 3” ball valve then Cetus sieve to a 22,000 vari pump can run at full speed without issue as it splits after the pump into 1.5” supply to easypod then returns above pond via reed bed and blade at around 5,000 lph & 1.5” supply to EA 55wUV and 2” bypass both to an underwater2” return.

    The Cetus sieve dam will move up or down to accommodate the change in demand from the pump. Lots of ball valves ensure I can get the right flow or bypass if taking uv out for servicing
    1kGal BD/Skim RDF/UV/k1 2.3kGal 2windows 2airBD/skim Sieve/Eazypod RDFcombi+bakki 3xVP/UV,ASHP

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  19. #12
    Senior Member Rank = Sansai ABN67's Avatar
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    Good morning Mike, thankyou for clearing that up for me, it seems I get one thing straight in my thoughts and plans then another question or doubt rears its head, so much to take on board, there's a world of difference between a pond set up and the aquariums that I'm used to so there'll probably be a whole lot more questions over the course of this build.

    Andy

  20. #13
    Senior Member Rank = Hassai Mike Bass's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ABN67 View Post
    Good morning Mike, thankyou for clearing that up for me, it seems I get one thing straight in my thoughts and plans then another question or doubt rears its head, so much to take on board, there's a world of difference between a pond set up and the aquariums that I'm used to so there'll probably be a whole lot more questions over the course of this build.

    Andy
    No worries as well as diy savings can be made by buying 2nd hand below is a list of the items I managed to buy from eb@y or forum members

    Imperial 150 year old bricks, 2 pond windows, pressure pipe valves in a job lot, bowls and nets, Cetus sieve, easypod, Filtreau combi drum( 2 weeks old from a dealer with some plastic media) ,tempered glass jump guards( shop shelving that were perfect size) , Window to pump house ( free bathroom shower screen) , Thermatec ASHP, 2x sheds to build pump room, BHM & CSM ceramic media, one of the bottom drains, EV 55 w UV,blue deep inspection vats……


    …..even then the whole build & equipment cost circa of £15k
    Last edited by Mike Bass; 07-09-2022 at 12:56 PM.
    1kGal BD/Skim RDF/UV/k1 2.3kGal 2windows 2airBD/skim Sieve/Eazypod RDFcombi+bakki 3xVP/UV,ASHP

  21. #14
    Senior Member Rank = Sansai ABN67's Avatar
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    Quick update to my build plan

    Decided to go with hollow concrete blocks 440x215x215 with 12mm rebar and filled with concrete, blocks and concrete etc ordered so hoping to start before the weather changes.
    After much planning and measuring and recalculating to make the most of the available space my final dimensions are going to be pond 4.6m x2.4m x1.9m deep, filter house 3m x 2.4m.
    Unfortunately the access I have is only 850mm wide so no chance to use a mini digger so digging by hand to just over a metre depth, fingers crossed I don't hit clay too soon.
    Can't wait to get started, but at the same time dreading the digging.

    Will post some pics when I've made some progress and worked out how to post pics
    Last edited by ABN67; 26-09-2022 at 09:58 AM. Reason: Added comment about pics

  22. #15
    Senior Member Rank = Jussai Spongebob's Avatar
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    Unless you really want a nexus, that’s something I’d rethink……
    Fibreglassed/5000 gals/4.5 m Tunnel/Spindrifter/Twin drums/Bio chambers/Beads/Showers/Remora ASHP

  23. #16
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Nisai clive1964's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ABN67 View Post
    Quick update to my build plan

    Decided to go with hollow concrete blocks 440x215x215 with 12mm rebar and filled with concrete, blocks and concrete etc ordered so hoping to start before the weather changes.
    After much planning and measuring and recalculating to make the most of the available space my final dimensions are going to be pond 4.6m x2.4m x1.9m deep, filter house 3m x 2.4m.
    Unfortunately the access I have is only 850mm wide so no chance to use a mini digger so digging by hand to just over a metre depth, fingers crossed I don't hit clay too soon.
    Can't wait to get started, but at the same time dreading the digging.

    Will post some pics when I've made some progress and worked out how to post pics

    Hi,

    If I were you, I would enquire about a Micro digger, or pinch digger, the track width can be reduced to less than 850mm wide, it will certainly save your back, even if you still have to barrow the spoil to a point where a Grab lorry could pick it up to take it away.

    Cheers

    Clive.

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  25. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by ABN67 View Post
    Quick update to my build plan

    Decided to go with hollow concrete blocks 440x215x215 with 12mm rebar and filled with concrete, blocks and concrete etc ordered so hoping to start before the weather changes.
    After much planning and measuring and recalculating to make the most of the available space my final dimensions are going to be pond 4.6m x2.4m x1.9m deep, filter house 3m x 2.4m.
    Unfortunately the access I have is only 850mm wide so no chance to use a mini digger so digging by hand to just over a metre depth, fingers crossed I don't hit clay too soon.
    Can't wait to get started, but at the same time dreading the digging.

    Will post some pics when I've made some progress and worked out how to post pics
    Kubota 0.8 ton have tracks that reducing to 71cm then go out for digging. Will easily dig a meter down .

    Sent from my SM-A516B using Tapatalk

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  27. #18
    Senior Member Rank = Sansai ABN67's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Graeme View Post
    Kubota 0.8 ton have tracks that reducing to 71cm then go out for digging. Will easily dig a meter down .

    Sent from my SM-A516B using Tapatalk
    Nice 1, I'll look into that

  28. #19
    Senior Member Rank = Sansai ABN67's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by clive1964 View Post
    Hi,

    If I were you, I would enquire about a Micro digger, or pinch digger, the track width can be reduced to less than 850mm wide, it will certainly save your back, even if you still have to barrow the spoil to a point where a Grab lorry could pick it up to take it away.

    Cheers

    Clive.
    Nice 1, I'm going to Google micro diggers see what I can find

  29. #20
    Senior Member Rank = Sansai ABN67's Avatar
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    So taking on board the replies here and after reading through many many pond builds I think I'll go for a drum filter rather than a nexus, during my many searches and price comparisons on Google the filtreau and qk drums fall into my budget and on paper atleast seem to tick most of my boxes so has any body here got any experience of filtreau or qk drums either positive or negative or maybe any other suggestions for me to look into

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