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  1. #21
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Supreme Champion Frimley Koi keeper's Avatar
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    It confused me too hence my earlier reply lol

  2. #22
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Adult Champion NickK-UK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mannh85 View Post
    Thanks for all the feedback chaps, the plumbing side of things just gives me a headache!



    I haven't ruled out soil pipe entirely yet, and may be the way to go I think, the rubber Tee would be ideal but I don't want to risk it!

    So did I understand correctly that 110mm sold pipe will go straight onto 4" pressure pipe?
    No.

    Imperial measurements - the 4" defines the inner bore diameter. Depending on the pipe class as the wall thickness changes with pressure rating then the outside diameter changes. Class is measured A-F etc.
    Metric measurements - the 110mm defines the outside pipe diameter, depending on the pipe class the wall thickness changes with pressure rating then the inside bore diameter changes. Class is measured PNxx xx = bar, eg PN10..


    So for imperial - 4" class C will not fit a class E for example as the outside diameters all vary.. so you can't mix 4" class B pipe with a class C or E fitting for example.

    For metric - a 110mm will be interchangeable - only the inside bore diameter changes, so soil pipe works with drainage and pressure pipe PN10, PN12 or even PN16. So as long as the flow rate is good.. you're flexible!

    Some genius then created rubber Flexi boot fittings.. and the world thought sunshine shone from his posterior. Flexiboot 4" will screw up to fit a 110mm..
    14000l, my mutts: Chargoi (2010), Doitsu (2022), Tancho (2022), Kujaku (2022), Hi Utusri (2022)

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  4. #23
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    Thanks Nick

  5. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by NickK-UK View Post

    Imperial measurements - the 4" defines the inner bore diameter. Depending on the pipe class as the wall thickness changes with pressure rating then the outside diameter changes. Class is measured A-F etc.

    Metric measurements - the 110mm defines the outside pipe diameter, depending on the pipe class the wall thickness changes with pressure rating then the inside bore diameter changes. Class is measured PNxx xx = bar, eg PN10..

    So for imperial - 4" class C will not fit a class E for example as the outside diameters all vary.. so you can't mix 4" class B pipe with a class C or E fitting for example.

    For metric - a 110mm will be interchangeable - only the inside bore diameter changes, so soil pipe works with drainage and pressure pipe PN10, PN12 or even PN16. So as long as the flow rate is good.. you're flexible!

    Some genius then created rubber Flexi boot fittings.. and the world thought sunshine shone from his posterior. Flexiboot 4" will screw up to fit a 110mm..
    Nick, the sizes of Imperial pipes are nominal bore sizes which changes according to the pipe class (pressure and mechanical strength rating). I.e. the bore size for class E is a little less than class C because it is "tougher" and therefore has thicker walls but the outside diameters are the same so any class pipe will fit in standard fittings.

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  7. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manky Sanke View Post
    Nick, the sizes of Imperial pipes are nominal bore sizes which changes according to the pipe class (pressure and mechanical strength rating). I.e. the bore size for class E is a little less than class C because it is "tougher" and therefore has thicker walls but the outside diameters are the same so any class pipe will fit in standard fittings.
    That's what I thought - only the inner bores changes for the classes of pipe but in this heat I was struggling to remember my own name !!!!!!

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  9. #26
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Adult Champion NickK-UK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manky Sanke View Post
    Nick, the sizes of Imperial pipes are nominal bore sizes which changes according to the pipe class (pressure and mechanical strength rating). I.e. the bore size for class E is a little less than class C because it is "tougher" and therefore has thicker walls but the outside diameters are the same so any class pipe will fit in standard fittings.
    That “nominal” is what made me go metric in the end.

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  11. #27
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    That class rating explains why the cleaning tube for an Eazy Pod will fit inside the 3" pressure pipe used for an Eazy Pod but wouldn't fit inside the 3" pressure pipe I made my spray bar out of. Good old EA using the lowest rated pressure pipe they could find LOL

  12. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manky Sanke View Post
    Nick, the sizes of Imperial pipes are nominal bore sizes which changes according to the pipe class (pressure and mechanical strength rating). I.e. the bore size for class E is a little less than class C because it is "tougher" and therefore has thicker walls but the outside diameters are the same so any class pipe will fit in standard fittings.
    You only need to buy one size of pressure pipe fittings not different ones for different classes or be forced to use flexi rubber boots more often

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  14. #29
    Senior Member Rank = Nanasai Handy Kenny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by freddyboy View Post
    I have just replaced two rubber connectors
    Sunlight started to crack and split them
    I have rubbrmer boots in filter house 5 years old now.. but the ones outside I do a weekly check on them. The UV Ray's of the sun knackers them up
    Fred

    Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk
    freddyboy,

    Not all rubber boots are the same and not a lot of people know that. Unfortunately most people go for the least expensive they can find which tend to have more PVC in them and are much less flexible than the most expensive which are EPDM. The PVC varieties are also more affected by UV and other weather conditions and subsequently fail. The tightening clips on less expensive varieties also fail prematurely, mostly because people have to overtighten them to achieve a proper watertight and airtight seal. Buying a no-name variety (normally made in China) is going to cost you in the longer term where some others (made in the UK) have a guarantee (when correctly fitted). The EPDM varieties also have a higher co-efficient of friction which simply means that they are much less liable to slip off the end of a PVC pipe. The market leader for flexible couplings in the UK is Flexseal which is their brand name. They are a subsidiary of Fernco and have 75% of the UK market which tells me a lot and informs my buying decisions. When all of my water is pumped through these rubber connectors I personally would not want to risk them failing.

    What has really hacked me off in the past is where I have purchased a quality named variety online and then been sent a much cheaper alternative. My view of a well known koi company changed completely when that happened.

    As Ant62 added as his strap line "You get what you pay for" to which we need to add - but sometimes you just don't!

    Kenny

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  16. #30
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion freddyboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Handy Kenny View Post
    freddyboy,

    Not all rubber boots are the same and not a lot of people know that. Unfortunately most people go for the least expensive they can find which tend to have more PVC in them and are much less flexible than the most expensive which are EPDM. The PVC varieties are also more affected by UV and other weather conditions and subsequently fail. The tightening clips on less expensive varieties also fail prematurely, mostly because people have to overtighten them to achieve a proper watertight and airtight seal. Buying a no-name variety (normally made in China) is going to cost you in the longer term where some others (made in the UK) have a guarantee (when correctly fitted). The EPDM varieties also have a higher co-efficient of friction which simply means that they are much less liable to slip off the end of a PVC pipe. The market leader for flexible couplings in the UK is Flexseal which is their brand name. They are a subsidiary of Fernco and have 75% of the UK market which tells me a lot and informs my buying decisions. When all of my water is pumped through these rubber connectors I personally would not want to risk them failing.

    What has really hacked me off in the past is where I have purchased a quality named variety online and then been sent a much cheaper alternative. My view of a well known koi company changed completely when that happened.

    As Ant62 added as his strap line "You get what you pay for" to which we need to add - but sometimes you just don't!

    Kenny
    It will be frenco from now on kenny. Your right mate. It costs me more in the long run.
    Cheers for info mate
    Fred

    Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

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  18. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Handy Kenny View Post
    freddyboy,

    Not all rubber boots are the same and not a lot of people know that. Unfortunately most people go for the least expensive they can find which tend to have more PVC in them and are much less flexible than the most expensive which are EPDM. The PVC varieties are also more affected by UV and other weather conditions and subsequently fail. The tightening clips on less expensive varieties also fail prematurely, mostly because people have to overtighten them to achieve a proper watertight and airtight seal. Buying a no-name variety (normally made in China) is going to cost you in the longer term where some others (made in the UK) have a guarantee (when correctly fitted). The EPDM varieties also have a higher co-efficient of friction which simply means that they are much less liable to slip off the end of a PVC pipe. The market leader for flexible couplings in the UK is Flexseal which is their brand name. They are a subsidiary of Fernco and have 75% of the UK market which tells me a lot and informs my buying decisions. When all of my water is pumped through these rubber connectors I personally would not want to risk them failing.

    What has really hacked me off in the past is where I have purchased a quality named variety online and then been sent a much cheaper alternative. My view of a well known koi company changed completely when that happened.

    As Ant62 added as his strap line "You get what you pay for" to which we need to add - but sometimes you just don't!

    Kenny
    Nice one Kenny

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  20. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by freddyboy View Post
    It will be frenco from now on kenny. Your right mate. It costs me more in the long run.
    Cheers for info mate
    Fred

    Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk
    Yes Fernco are one of the brands I used and they tend to do more sizes than others too. Only thing is they are based in the US I think so can be difficult getting all the range over here.

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  22. #33
    Senior Member Rank = Nanasai Handy Kenny's Avatar
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    Frimley,

    Flexseal which are part of Fernco are in Barnsley UK, They offer their own branded products i.e. Flexseal which are the EPDM connectors and they also offer the Fernco branded products which are more PVC and so less expensive. It is much less difficult to get hold of the superior Flexseal branded product than (the less expensive) Fernco branded products. One of the reasons that PVC connectors come in a bigger variety of sizes is that they are far less pliable than the EPDM variety and wouldn't clamp down properly on a variety of differently sized pipes. From a retailers point of view holding half the stock to satisfy customer demand is a preferrable option.

    Kenny

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  24. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Handy Kenny View Post
    Frimley,

    Flexseal which are part of Fernco are in Barnsley UK, They offer their own branded products i.e. Flexseal which are the EPDM connectors and they also offer the Fernco branded products which are more PVC and so less expensive. It is much less difficult to get hold of the superior Flexseal branded product than (the less expensive) Fernco branded products. One of the reasons that PVC connectors come in a bigger variety of sizes is that they are far less pliable than the EPDM variety and wouldn't clamp down properly on a variety of differently sized pipes. From a retailers point of view holding half the stock to satisfy customer demand is a preferrable option.

    Kenny
    Thanks Kenny.

    I have some that are Flexseal which is good to hear that they are a version of Fernco

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