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  1. #1

    Gold Carp looking iffy..... can you help?

    Hi - this is my first post here. Amateur koi and carp keeper - inherited a pond but have made a go of it over seven years... HELLO!!!

    Anyway.... I have a golden carp - "Goldie" - quite big - who is very listless atm and has some dark markings. He's never had a perfect golden skin but he is looking a little peaky atm. I can touch him and he doesn;t really react. Not normal... PIctures attached. What do you think his problem may be. He's about 6-7 years old. 20220723_105100.jpg20220723_105057.jpg20220723_105108.jpg Any advise / help would be greatly appreciated....



  2. #2
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion Ajm's Avatar
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    Ideally we need to see the water test results and if possible mucus scrapes as a first investigation

    And some more information on the pond please gal filter ect how do you top up the water level

    Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
    Freddyboy the legend

    "we are water keepers first"

    Johnathan

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  4. #3
    I agree. Water parameters are the first thing to check because bad parameters can cause health problems directly or weaken the immune system so that a fish succumbs to a parasite or pathogen it could otherwise have resisted. Even if poor water quality doesn't play a part in initiating a health issue, koi have a much better chance of recovering in good water than in bad.

    The minimum parameters you should check are pH, ammonia and nitrite. Nitrate and KH can also give valuable information to help interpret other parameters. To make a proper diagnosis we need actual values not “all ok” etc.

    If any water parameter is incorrect then it should be brought to an acceptable value as quickly as possible so as not to unnecessarily delay any medical treatment that may subsequently be needed.

    Once suboptimal water has been ruled out as the cause then the correct procedure is to scrape in order to identify if any parasites are present and choose the appropriate treatment.

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  6. #4
    Hi - thanks again for your replies. I have done a water test. Carbonate hardness is too low. I am adding some water to address this today. Also my ph value has just dropped to 6.4,, marginally too low. All the other fish are happy. I don't 'think' (think doing some heavy lifting here) that the water quality is the problem.
    Goldie is still listless. I can even handle him. He is buoyant and the right way up... but he ain't right!!

    Just noticed you requested actual values: nitrate 0, nitrite 0.03, dH(hardness) 0, carbonate hardness dH 1, ph 6.4, chlorine 0, carbon dioxide 7 mg/l
    Last edited by paul cullen; 26-07-2022 at 09:21 AM.

  7. #5
    There's no ammonia value in those tests; are you using test strips? Apart from being very inaccurate, an indicated pH value of 6.4 on a test strip possibly means that the pH is much lower than that but the strip can't respond to it which would be supported by such a low KH (carbonate hardness).

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  9. #6
    I am using a strip. I should add: the rest of my fish appear to be fine. OK... I think I have an old liquid testing kit somewhere... will dig it out.... thanks again

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  11. #7
    I think you are definitely onto something with the PH. The water is notoriously hard.... I was looking at symptoms for acidity in pond and - yes - there are some signs of this with the fish.... Maybe goldie is extra sensitive..(?)

  12. #8
    Quick follow up question: what is the best way of testing the pond's PH? How about these electronic gadgets? Any good?

  13. #9
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion RS2OOO's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paul cullen View Post
    Quick follow up question: what is the best way of testing the pond's PH? How about these electronic gadgets? Any good?
    The simplest long-term cost effective way is to buy this kit to test for everything that is important including pH, it will probably last right up till 3+ year expiry date for general periodic testing:

    https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/200473067...3ABFBM0qXpoMdg


    Visibly there didn't look to be anything wrong with Goldie. I think there is a trace of pox on the tail which would normally have cleared up by this time of year, and this re-affirms what others have said - the initial indication here suggests water as the culprit and that this may be having a knock on effect to the immune system.

    Bad water potentially leads to other issues - weaker immune system (the pox on the tail), pathogen/parasite numbers increase etc etc.


    If you are in a hard water area you would expect to see a pH between 7.8 and 8.2. The fact your KH is low and pH is very low suggests your pond is on the verge of a pH crash and if this is the case it could quickly wipe out everything in the pond.

    I think this analysis would be further supported if it turns out Goldie is one of the biggest fish in the pond.

    How often do you change / add water to the pond? If not very often this again would support the pH crash theory.

    You will need to work on boosting pH and KH to normal levels through dechlorinated water changes, initially as a matter of urgency just to get some KH back into the water, but subsequently at a pace that will raise it gradually to avoid shocking the system.

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  15. #10
    This is information I recently posted about ORP meters (on here, I think) but it equally applies to pH meters or any meter that has a glass or plastic probe so I've tweaked it a bit to make it more applicable to any meter.

    "The electronics in these types of devices is fairly easy and cheap to manufacture in places like China so that aspect doesn't make one manufacturer's product any more reliable than any of the others.

    The probes themselves are the main cost in the manufacture so the reason that some devices last longer and are more reliable is the quality of the probe. Bear in mind that you get what you pay for; the more expensive ones tend to have better quality probes which last longer before they fail and the drift in calibration is slower and less pronounced so they need less frequent calibration.

    Cheaper ones are the opposite. The probes have to cost less in order to keep the total manufacturing costs down so they tend not to last very long and need more frequent calibration. Some cheap ones may even need calibrating before every use.

    The time taken for the reading to settle to the final value also varies. This will increase with age with all probes but cheaper probes tend to take longer to settle even when they’re new.

    To prolong the probe life of whichever model you buy, they must not be allowed to dry out. If you plan to use the meter again within a couple of hours (e.g., monitoring the effect of a treatment such as potassium permanganate over a few hours) they can be kept in pond water in between uses but for longer term storage, they are best stored in the storage solution recommended by the manufacturer."

    So, that said, if you intend to buy a pH meter (or any meter with a glass probe), don't buy the cheapest because they will obviously have a cheaply made probe which will go out of calibration quickly, but even the probe in an expensive meter will drift out of calibration after a few weeks so the only way to be sure that you have an accurate reading is to calibrate it before use.

    Hope that helps but don't take to long deciding because your pond pH is likely to be lower than the 6.4 value that your test strip says.

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  17. #11
    not sure if it has been mentioned but you could also add bicarb to bring the KH/pH up.

 

 

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