Welcome to Koi Forum. Is this your first visit? Register
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 32
  1. #1
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion RS2OOO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    South East
    Posts
    5,151
    Thanks / Likes
    11707

    Choosing a New Kohaku..... Which one?

    First fish into my dedicated Koi-only pond was a cheap 8cm long £16 Sakai Kohaku. Not a terrible Koi by any means, but didn't really grow except for a tiny growth spurt in 2020, and now at 5 years old she's reached the grand size of 44cm and starting to lose beni.

    Always wanted a nice Kohaku but kept waiting until a time came when I felt confident enough to try and choose a nice one at an amount I'm willing to spend on a Koi.... i.e not a lot seeing as the most expensive Koi in my pond was £350.

    The problem with Kohaku is I keep changing my mind about favourite patterns..... Used to be the big 2 steps with a white stripe around the middle, then I liked 3 steps, then started to find 3 steps boring so got into 4 steps.... and after a while decided I just want something with a funky pattern but still a preference for 4 steps.

    Yeah... pattern first for me, trying to get the whole package is obviously the aim, just limited by budget.

    So I've been looking seriously since about February and lost out on one or 2, but here are the final contenders, all bowled and viewed in person, but before posting which one I went for I'd love to know what your choice would be and why.....and don't be afraid to say they are all rubbish, just give a reason why


    Kohaku 1: Matsue female Tosai, 32cm






    Kohaku no.2: Matsue unsexed Tosai (but looks male) 31cm









    Kohaku no.3: Takigawa unsexed Tosai, 27cm:



    Last edited by RS2OOO; 25-06-2022 at 09:13 PM.

  2. Thanks samp09 Thanked / Liked this Post
  3. #2
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion Ajm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Location
    Durham
    Posts
    9,914
    Thanks / Likes
    19155
    Number 1 for me . Really like that

    3 looks to have some shoulders on it but the pecs like pointed and deeper colour so possibly a male ? ?

    Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
    Freddyboy the legend

    "we are water keepers first"

    Johnathan

  4. Thanks RS2OOO Thanked / Liked this Post
  5. #3
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion samp09's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Location
    Suffolk
    Posts
    2,753
    Thanks / Likes
    5567
    Number 1 for me too as like you, I like a funky pattern on a Kohaku! You could always pay Adam Byer a visit when he releases his kohaku if you wanted another one, great quality and very well priced too!

  6. Thanks Ajm, RS2OOO Thanked / Liked this Post
  7. #4
    Shame about the beni on the tail end of number 1 if that was not there then great fish BUT number 2 for me big pecs and nice pattern and shoulders and the beni stop just before the tail making the fish look bigger when larger will be a big fish

  8. Thanks RS2OOO Thanked / Liked this Post
  9. #5
    Number 2 for me aswell big pecs and nice pattern great whites. number 1 pattern all over the place and donít like the eyes makes them look like they pop out


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  10. Thanks RS2OOO Thanked / Liked this Post
  11. #6
    Senior Member Rank = Jussai g mac's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Posts
    1,199
    Thanks / Likes
    2238
    Out of those three, I would opt for number 2
    7500 litres
    Filtreau combi with uv.
    Some koi

  12. Thanks RS2OOO Thanked / Liked this Post
  13. #7
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion davethefish1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Bedworth
    Posts
    4,117
    Thanks / Likes
    8787
    another one for number 2,
    i just have a thing about not liking the googley eyes on koi number 1
    though that could change when much bigger...

    a good point by colin about the pattern when bigger on number 2, would look much more imposing.

  14. Thanks RS2OOO Thanked / Liked this Post
  15. #8
    Senior Member Rank = Gosai rolo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2020
    Location
    wakefield
    Posts
    310
    Thanks / Likes
    494
    No 2 for me a clear four step kohaku but as mentioned already if possible a visit to Adam Byers could well change your mind again.
    If only i lived nearer.

    keith

  16. Thanks Ajm, RS2OOO Thanked / Liked this Post
  17. #9
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Supreme Champion john1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    N.Wales.
    Posts
    7,622
    Thanks / Likes
    13723
    Definitely no 2 lovely spread out pattern neatly formed.

    Where are they from Rs?
    John

  18. Thanks RS2OOO Thanked / Liked this Post
  19. #10
    Senior Member Rank = Jussai Spongebob's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Location
    Manchester
    Posts
    1,178
    Thanks / Likes
    2157
    No 1 stands out for me and good sized female tosai.
    Fibreglassed/5000 gals/4.5 m Tunnel/Spindrifter/Twin drums/Bio chambers/Beads/Showers/Remora ASHP

  20. Thanks RS2OOO Thanked / Liked this Post
  21. #11
    Number 2 for me.
    34,000L, 2xSpindrifters, Aqua Sieve2, Nexus300, 24in K1/bead, Momotaro Bakki, 17kwThermotec Inverter

  22. Thanks RS2OOO Thanked / Liked this Post
  23. #12
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion RS2OOO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    South East
    Posts
    5,151
    Thanks / Likes
    11707
    Wow, thanks for so many opinions. Glad so many of you replied.

    Going to shock you all now..... I went with no.3 !!!!!

    Nobody on a couple of Whatsapp Koi groups I post to picked number 3 either.

    No.1 was my first choice, even put a deposit on it before viewing.

    Went to view no.2 and no.3 and out of 100 Kohaku in the vat number 2 stood out loads, the Shiroji was incredible, another level compared to anything else in the vat, and the beni was so deep, easily in the top 3.

    Bowled it and liked it, but the body looked weak, quite shallow especially towards the back, almost certainly male with a typical slender male body. The Sashi extended forward by 2 or 3 scales (not clear in the Dealer photo - but see video I took below), so not sure how it would turn out, definitely a gamble, but the slender body and shallow backbone kept putting me off, so number 3 was added to the bowl to compare. Number 3 instantly stood out as having much better proportions, has a softer beni (a female trait at Tosai), the vent looked more female than male, the sashi and kiwa look much more refined (a male trait maybe), the shiroji not quite as white as no.2 but still in the top 10 within the vat. Pattern is nice but definitely less interesting, maybe even boring, but its a big koi pattern that will grow with the fish, whereas I felt as a big fish no.2 would have too much white space between the beni steps. The body on number 3 was way better, a lot more balanced, something that is hard to see in the photos.

    So now it was between no.1 and no.3.

    Went to view no.1 and it would be fair to say it does not look like the photo. Interestingly this Koi was selected by Mike Snaden, which does kind of sway you a little bit but at the end of the day he's choosing koi to match a set budget.

    I Appreciate no.1 had just come out of QT and was a bit skinny as expected, but to my untrained eyes, and they really are untrained as far as Tosai are concerned, the beni looked really weak, a very light orange and a few scales that already looked to have fading beni plus a few areas where I felt the colour might break up. Shiroji was hard to judge as it was off-white due to the environment it was being kept in. Body was really good, I just thought the beni had too many risks for a £495 koi, plus there was a dodgy patch of "flowery" secondary beni lower down covering about 5 or 6 scales - a compromise I'd have lived with if the rest of the Koi was excellent.

    So there you have it - from the pictures no.1 was my favourite, no.2 second favourite, and no.3 last, yet having viewed in person I came home with number 3 (the cheapest of the 3) and whilst the pattern isn't super interesting, I think it will be a solid reliable Koi, and from a great breeder.

    Here's a video of 2 and 3 in the bowl together (this was 1 week after arrival in the UK, so still in QT and not being fed):



    https://www.youtube.com/shorts/6Ivt0bg5aoY


    And here's a photo of no.3 on collection day, after QT was completed and the Dealer was conditioning them for sale:




    And for interest here's my own photo of no.2 where you can better see the sashi. This will tighten up but I reckon by the end of it there will be even less beni than there is now and the Koi will have too much white-ground when it is bigger. My guess is that the body will always be slender, but could end up being very wrong on that count. The Shiroji though, it is incredible for the price no doubt about that.



    For anyone interested the Kohaku 1 is still for sale at Gatwick Koi and Kohaku 2 available from Koi Waterlife.

    For sure I wish number 1 was as I hoped it would be when placing a deposit, and I wish number 2 had a better body shape because the colouration was outstanding and the pattern really nice, but for me number 3 was the best overall Koi and really looks good in the pond.

    Wish I could have had all 3 just to see them develop, but will post an update next year so you can see how number 3 turns out.
    Last edited by RS2OOO; 26-06-2022 at 06:59 PM.

  24. Thanks Ajm, Mikeh83, john1 Thanked / Liked this Post
  25. #13
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Supreme Champion john1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    N.Wales.
    Posts
    7,622
    Thanks / Likes
    13723
    Your fish at the end of the day Rs and a very nice choice.

    What I liked about no 2 was the broad head even though it had a slender body and probably Male.
    Did you say they were tosai?
    John

  26. Thanks RS2OOO Thanked / Liked this Post
  27. #14
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion RS2OOO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    South East
    Posts
    5,151
    Thanks / Likes
    11707
    Quote Originally Posted by john1 View Post
    Your fish at the end of the day Rs and a very nice choice.

    What I liked about no 2 was the broad head even though it had a slender body and probably Male.
    Did you say they were tosai?
    All 3 were Tosai John, and not bad sizes for Tosai either.

    Considering the prices of everything these days I think all 3 were worth the asking prices.

    Will never 100% know if I picked the right one - need people on here to grab the other 2 , but I'm happy with the end result, its a nice quality Koi for sure.

  28. Thanks john1, Ajm Thanked / Liked this Post
  29. #15
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion Ajm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Location
    Durham
    Posts
    9,914
    Thanks / Likes
    19155
    Quote Originally Posted by RS2OOO View Post
    All 3 were Tosai John, and not bad sizes for Tosai either.

    Considering the prices of everything these days I think all 3 were worth the asking prices.

    Will never 100% know if I picked the right one - need people on here to grab the other 2 , but I'm happy with the end result, its a nice quality Koi for sure.
    Would love no 1 where was it mate ?

    Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
    Freddyboy the legend

    "we are water keepers first"

    Johnathan

  30. #16
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion RS2OOO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    South East
    Posts
    5,151
    Thanks / Likes
    11707
    Quote Originally Posted by Ajm View Post
    Would love no 1 where was it mate ?

    Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
    As above mate, look on Gatwick koi's website, Matsue Tosai Kohaku, £495.

    Compare it to everything else on his website at that price range and it does look a great deal for the money, especially being female.

    Only thing is Johnathan, he doesn't post koi as far as I know, which means you'd have to venture South and endure all the rude gobby southerners Choosing a New Kohaku..... Which one?

    Sent from my Pixel 4a using Tapatalk
    Last edited by RS2OOO; 26-06-2022 at 08:02 PM.

  31. Thanks samp09, Ajm Thanked / Liked this Post
  32. #17
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion samp09's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Location
    Suffolk
    Posts
    2,753
    Thanks / Likes
    5567
    Johnathan loves a day in London

  33. Thanks Ajm, RS2OOO Thanked / Liked this Post
  34. #18
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion Ajm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Location
    Durham
    Posts
    9,914
    Thanks / Likes
    19155
    Quote Originally Posted by RS2OOO View Post
    As above mate, look on Gatwick koi's website, Matsue Tosai Kohaku, £495.

    Compare it to everything else on his website at that price range and it does look a great deal for the money, especially being female.

    Only thing is Johnathan, he doesn't post koi as far as I know, which means you'd have to venture South and endure all the rude gobby southerners Choosing a New Kohaku..... Which one?

    Sent from my Pixel 4a using Tapatalk
    I'll give it a miss !!!!!!

    Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
    Freddyboy the legend

    "we are water keepers first"

    Johnathan

  35. Thanks RS2OOO, samp09 Thanked / Liked this Post
  36. #19
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion Ajm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Location
    Durham
    Posts
    9,914
    Thanks / Likes
    19155
    Quote Originally Posted by samp09 View Post
    Johnathan loves a day in London
    Yeah long as I have some one else's credit card

    Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
    Freddyboy the legend

    "we are water keepers first"

    Johnathan

  37. Thanks RS2OOO, samp09 Thanked / Liked this Post
  38. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by RS2OOO View Post
    As above mate, look on Gatwick koi's website, Matsue Tosai Kohaku, £495.

    Compare it to everything else on his website at that price range and it does look a great deal for the money, especially being female.

    Only thing is Johnathan, he doesn't post koi as far as I know, which means you'd have to venture South and endure all the rude gobby southerners Choosing a New Kohaku..... Which one?

    Sent from my Pixel 4a using Tapatalk
    I am sure Gatwick Gary posts fish as I had a Ochiba from him

    Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk

  39. Thanks RS2OOO Thanked / Liked this Post
 

 
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
All times are GMT +1. The time now is 12:17 AM. Online Koi Mag Forum
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.3
Copyright © 2022 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.

vBulletin Improved By vBFoster® (Lite Version), © UltimateScheme, Ltd.