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  1. #1

    Hard food problem choices made harder with unheated pond.

    Hi Guys, Looking for peoples thoughts on helping me make my season food choices? I need a low protein,fat wheatgerm for the colder months of the year. And I think because I'm not heated it makes my choices,that bit harder! My Fish like to be fed as low as 5 degrees. So in the past I've fed them coppens wheat germ. But this time , I will either trying hikari wheat germ or aqausource wheat germ. And I will be using Saki Balance again this year for the warmer weather. I've heard even in airtight containers the nutrients and vitamins start degrading after 90 days? So do I use 2kg/5kg blue bags and keep an eye on the temps or buy 15kg sack. At the risk of carrying so many kg over for the following year? 15kg sack £169.95 or maybe 3x5kgs=£236.85 That would work out at £70.89 more. May be , I'm overthinking it? And I should just get the 15kg sack and risk carrying it over to the following year! Thank you



  2. #2
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion Ajm's Avatar
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    Last 2 years I've fed SH balance all year round . Unheated uncovered pond . Haven't bothered with wheatgerm ect . Last year was tye first year round feeding and coming in to spring 2023 I felt the fish were stronger and in better health starting the season .

    DTF vacuum packs his feed just taking smaller amounts at a time which tbf seems a very sensible idea !

    On which feed to chose , me and samp just had this discussion ending in the FD food is up there with SH as the best ones on the market as Sam was telling me the owner of FD was one of the top lads at SH before leaving and setting up on his own , when Sam was looking " FD mighty " was pretty much the same as "SH balance " although not a massive saving sure sam said about £40 saving to use FD as as he stated they don't use the MASSIVE advertising budget SH . I tend to listen to Sam around stuff like this he dose his reading !!!!

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  4. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Ajm View Post
    Last 2 years I've fed SH balance all year round . Unheated uncovered pond . Haven't bothered with wheatgerm ect . Last year was tye first year round feeding and coming in to spring 2023 I felt the fish were stronger and in better health starting the season .

    DTF vacuum packs his feed just taking smaller amounts at a time which tbf seems a very sensible idea !

    On which feed to chose , me and samp just had this discussion ending in the FD food is up there with SH as the best ones on the market as Sam was telling me the owner of FD was one of the top lads at SH before leaving and setting up on his own , when Sam was looking " FD mighty " was pretty much the same as "SH balance " although not a massive saving sure sam said about £40 saving to use FD as as he stated they don't use the MASSIVE advertising budget SH . I tend to listen to Sam around stuff like this he dose his reading !!!!

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    Hi Johnathan, Just being looking at the Fd Build up with 3% fat and you can feed it down to 5degrees. Might give it ago, Thank you.
    Last edited by Maddog1; 23-02-2024 at 04:11 AM.

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  6. #4
    Senior Member Rank = Jussai g mac's Avatar
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    My pond is unheated and uncovered. This winter I've not used any wheatgerm and went with Aqua Source all Season with Garlic. Fed with it down to 5 degrees. Once the water temp gets back up to around 15 will be reintroducing SH Balance and then SH Colour for one month, assuming temps get above 20.

    Haven't as yet checked out the FD food, will take a look, so thanks @Ajm and @Samp
    7500 litres
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  8. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by g mac View Post
    My pond is unheated and uncovered. This winter I've not used any wheatgerm and went with Aqua Source all Season with Garlic. Fed with it down to 5 degrees. Once the water temp gets back up to around 15 will be reintroducing SH Balance and then SH Colour for one month, assuming temps get
    Haven't as yet checked out the FD food, will take a look, so thanks @Ajm and @Samp
    Thank you. How did you find the Aqausource.

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  10. #6
    Senior Member Rank = Jussai Alburglar's Avatar
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    I second the aquasource with garlic. I've always avoided it because it's a floating food and my lot have previously only stirred for sinking foods in winter, wheatgerm etc. I gave it a try this year and they've been eating it happily down to about 5c. Sometimes they leave it for 5 minutes and pick at it continuously, but slowly, for 10-20 minutes but they never spit it. They constantly come back for it, but sometimes not with any great gusto, and sometimes they lap it up. It's that time of year though. For that reason some ends up down the skimmer sometimes, but I'd definitely use it again, but 50/50 with some sinking wheatgerm.

    I really don't think that anyone in Japan would feed Saki Hikari if they had to pay UK prices, they would find an alternative ( and then everyone would follow suit), so I personally am not ever going to obsessed with the stuff. I'm sure it's great, but I'm sure there's really good alternatives that make more sense. Likely to be, anything from coppens and the like.
    If it's good enough for Adam Byers, Carp Co, etc...

    I won a huge bag of Cuttlebrook food in the Koi club raffle which I'll be using this summer. I'm assuming that's another food made to spec by coppens?

    In the past, I've really got on well with Queni Koi / Kenko stuff. Some of my fish are absolute units now, after a couple of years despite being unheated and in a 1000litre IBC tank.
    Last edited by Alburglar; 23-02-2024 at 05:14 PM.
    2660 Gallons. 4" Bottom Drain and Skimmer. Draco Solum 16 Drum. Anoxic Filtration. Air lift returns.

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    Senior Member Rank = Jussai g mac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maddog1 View Post
    Thank you. How did you find the Aqausource.
    I think it's a very good food, with quality ingredients. I've used it for a good few years now, particularly late Autumn, Winter, Spring. Then SH Balance and Colour during the warmer period.
    7500 litres
    Filtreau combi with uv.
    Some koi

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    Senior Member Rank = Jussai Alburglar's Avatar
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    I am probably missing something obvious, but what is FD the abbreviation of?
    2660 Gallons. 4" Bottom Drain and Skimmer. Draco Solum 16 Drum. Anoxic Filtration. Air lift returns.

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    Member Rank = Nisai PhilN's Avatar
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    I was wondering that too. I don't think it is an abbreviation though https://www.absolute-koi.com/food-tr...s/fd-koi-food/

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    Senior Member Rank = Jussai Alburglar's Avatar
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    Oh yeah the chequered stuff. Not much cheaper than Saki Hikari though is it?
    2660 Gallons. 4" Bottom Drain and Skimmer. Draco Solum 16 Drum. Anoxic Filtration. Air lift returns.

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  20. #11
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion davethefish1's Avatar
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    i've been using hikari wheatgerm this winter and like it a lot. mixed with balance and colour.
    you have to be careful feeding small amounts as fish can get fat on it easily.
    but have not noticed large amounts of waste.

    the aquasource looks good but the ingredients listed confuse me?
    it only lists fishmeal and krill then garlic?
    which i can't imagine is in large amounts.

    so is the pellet 95% fishmeal and krill, which would make the protein 60-70% so what binds it together?
    also where do the 40% carbohydrates and 5% fibre come from? wheatgerm?

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  22. #12
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion Ajm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by g mac View Post
    I think it's a very good food, with quality ingredients. I've used it for a good few years now, particularly late Autumn, Winter, Spring. Then SH Balance and Colour during the warmer period.
    Sure gazkoi used to swear by that stuff aswell

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    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion Ajm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alburglar View Post
    Oh yeah the chequered stuff. Not much cheaper than Saki Hikari though is it?
    Don't believe its massively cheaper but in a day and age where every penny counts it could be enough of a saving to swing it in faver and still have a top quality feed

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  26. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Alburglar View Post
    I am probably missing something obvious, but what is FD the abbreviation of?
    Hi/ F=Fish. D-Dog. They were approach by a company to make a Dog Food for Guild Dogs, To make and develop a food with ingredient to relieve the stresses of the very stressful job of leading the Blind.

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    Member Rank = Nisai 118's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alburglar View Post
    I am probably missing something obvious, but what is FD the abbreviation of?
    could it be "Flipping Dear" ?

    substitute F's can also be applied.
    Democracy falls down at the point where you have to persuade stupid people to vote for you..

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  30. #16
    Another vote for aquasource here. I like their ultimate all season. Here are the ingredients. I use their growth and colour food above 18c, also very good.

    Ingredients list
    White Fish Meal, Wheat Flour, Krill, Fish Oil, Garlic, Propolis, Astaxanthin, Spirulina, Carotene, Minerals

    Composition: Protein 35%, Crude Fat 7%, Carbohydrates 40%, Ash 7%, Vitamin A, 10000 I.E/kg, Vitamin B3 1500 I.E/kg, Vitamin E 150 mg/kg, Vitamin C 120 mg/kg


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  32. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by BrucePondsteen View Post
    Another vote for aquasource here. I like their ultimate all season. Here are the ingredients. I use their growth and colour food above 18c, also very good.

    Ingredients list
    White Fish Meal, Wheat Flour, Krill, Fish Oil, Garlic, Propolis, Astaxanthin, Spirulina, Carotene, Minerals

    Composition: Protein 35%, Crude Fat 7%, Carbohydrates 40%, Ash 7%, Vitamin A, 10000 I.E/kg, Vitamin B3 1500 I.E/kg, Vitamin E 150 mg/kg, Vitamin C 120 mg/kg


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    Hi/ The ingredients look mint and it's cheaper than the Hikari wheat germ.

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  34. #18
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion davethefish1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BrucePondsteen View Post
    Another vote for aquasource here. I like their ultimate all season. Here are the ingredients. I use their growth and colour food above 18c, also very good.

    Ingredients list
    White Fish Meal, Wheat Flour, Krill, Fish Oil, Garlic, Propolis, Astaxanthin, Spirulina, Carotene, Minerals

    Composition: Protein 35%, Crude Fat 7%, Carbohydrates 40%, Ash 7%, Vitamin A, 10000 I.E/kg, Vitamin B3 1500 I.E/kg, Vitamin E 150 mg/kg, Vitamin C 120 mg/kg


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    thanks, that makes sense now
    the web site only lists fishmeal and krill as main ingredients but wheatflour as second ingredient makes sense.


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  36. #19
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion davethefish1's Avatar
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    Here's the ingredients on the hikari wheatgerm,
    wheatgerm is listed as the first and major ingredient,and fishmeal second
    but i like mixing it with balance and colour to up the fishmeal content with temps over 10C

    I'm also going to be adding it to my summer mix but in a much lower percentage.


    Last edited by davethefish1; 24-02-2024 at 10:22 AM.

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  38. #20
    Hi David, Everyone . Thank for your contest help, I asked a question yesterday on facebook about food degrading yesterday. And you were kind enough to answer,I've got 6,7 kg of saki Balance left from last year. And 3kg of last years coppens wheat germ left. So this year I will be using that up as soon as possible. And on taking your information on board about food degrading ,I will start and monitor my food usage over the up and coming weeks, temp related. And try to work out the best line of attack, bag sizes, proteins,fats, brands for the temps and time of year. Thank you again.

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