Thread: Katashigoi spitting food

Afternoon all. Hoping for some advice. I have a Karashigoi spitting food really regularly. Looks well enough despite this and does eat a somewhere close to half what it gets in its mouth, but spits the other half. It’s been doing it for a while now, 5 or 6 weeks that I’ve noticed.

I’m aware this is a symptom of gill flukes so I have scraped twice and found nothing. I haven’t done a gill scrape as it petrifies me, but I’ve done the normal three scrapes and a fourth right around the gills and found nothing. Water details below:

pH: 8.4
GH and KH: liquid rock high
Ammonia: 0 (did have a spike to 0.25ppm two weeks ago when stepped up feeding, but long gone now)
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 60 ppm
Heated to 24 Celsius

Large bio capacity, drum filter and strong flow now the heavy feeding has started. Pond just short of 3500 gallons.

I haven’t noticed any other fish spitting.

So - any ideas? Just a fish that grabs more than it can chew at once? Didn’t know if I should be worried or not…


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Couldn’t figure out how to edit the title - was supposed to be Karashigoi.


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What I’d do is observe other fish very closely during feeding time - if you see any other fish spitting you can bet money on its gill irritation - unless you got some chemicals in water it’s 99.99% flukes. Doesn’t have to be gill flukes as skin flukes can be in gills too. Even if your scraps are clean I’d consider up flukes treatment.

IF, however, this is REALLY a single fish spitting - from my experience it can be two reasons: 1) too much food, especially some fish annoying choose to swallow and spit and play with food - as opposed to just not put too much food on mouth when not hungry. 2) fussy eater, if your food freshly opened from this year or a left over pack from last season? Some fish are just picky and when not hungry don’t fancy old food

Originally Posted by NamoAmituofo

What I’d do is observe other fish very closely during feeding time - if you see any other fish spitting you can bet money on its gill irritation - unless you got some chemicals in water it’s 99.99% flukes. Doesn’t have to be gill flukes as skin flukes can be in gills too. Even if your scraps are clean I’d consider up flukes treatment.

IF, however, this is REALLY a single fish spitting - from my experience it can be two reasons: 1) too much food, especially some fish annoying choose to swallow and spit and play with food - as opposed to just not put too much food on mouth when not hungry. 2) fussy eater, if your food freshly opened from this year or a left over pack from last season? Some fish are just picky and when not hungry don’t fancy old food

I doubt it’s the food, it’s fresh Saki Hikari.

My gut was flukes too, but I’m loathe to treat when scrapes are clear. I’ll give it a few days and scrape again.


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Originally Posted by john1

Hi there Tom, sorry to hear your having more probs which you dont need.
Ok so it's one koi spitting food out and no others,I would be cutting back on food to see what happens,maybe flukes maybe not but see what happens when they get hungry.
So you have scraped Tom and nothing ok that's eliminating,I am not an expert as you know Tom will ask Paddy what to do if that's ok.

Thanks John. As I say, everything seems tip top. Cutting back on the food and see what happens is a good shout, because it is a real pig.


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Another product with a name reminiscent of Japan?
KUSURI is also a direct translation of DRUGS, which is why its packaging is so surprising.

I have a few that spit pellets from time to time and have been doing it for years.

I've found flukes in the past, treated, not found flukes again and they'll still do it.

Usually in the mornings, but not in the evenings.

I have found food spitting to possibily be related to a number of things over the years, but never nailed down the true cause.

Considerations, in order of liklihood:

• Flukes (usually gill but can be skin)
• Costia - Have definitely identified spitting associated with Costia outbreaks.
• Tooth ache or tooth shedding (might spit for a few days then go back to eating fine).
• Water parameter changes, particularly pH.
• Chlorine or some treatments such as CT, Virkon etc.
• Digestive tract irritation or general digestive issues (advised to me when I queried with Paula Reynolds).

To help narrow things down, try feeding cooked mussels or mealworms and see if the fish still spits. If they eat that food without issue I think it is less likely to be a serious problem requiring immediate treatment, but still something to keep an eye on and try to eventually get to the bottom of.

Thanks very much for the replies. All make sense.

I’ve got mussels in the freezer so that’s an easy way to start.

If that fails, I’ll give the fill scrape a go. I did watch Paddy do it so seeing it first hand before gives the confidence to have a go and be gentle.

@RS2000 - I hadn’t even thought about tooth ache/shedding.

I’m not overly concerned because all parameters are great and they are eating well and have scraped clean for weeks now.

I’ll keep you posted


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Well the mussels went down a treat with all of them. The Karagoshi munched at least two that I saw with no spitting and possibly had a third, another fish was in the way so I couldn’t see. Knowing what a pig it is, I suspect it did get the third.

I’m going to leave it a couple of days and then try a gill scrape. I’m beginning to suspect it’s not a parasite problem and maybe one from RS2000’s list.

I’ve got to say - without wanting to curse anything - the pond is looking superb at the moment. I’ve got everything crossed


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Originally Posted by Shropshire_Tom

Well the mussels went down a treat with all of them. The Karagoshi munched at least two that I saw with no spitting and possibly had a third, another fish was in the way so I couldn’t see. Knowing what a pig it is, I suspect it did get the third.

I’m going to leave it a couple of days and then try a gill scrape. I’m beginning to suspect it’s not a parasite problem and maybe one from RS2000’s list.

I’ve got to say - without wanting to curse anything - the pond is looking superb at the moment. I’ve got everything crossed


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Thanks for the update.

If you do come across any parasites or other potential causes over the summer, please update the thread. It would be great to get to the bottom of why this happens.

I currently have 3 spitting pellets in the mornings but not in the evenings, and like with yours they'll devour mussels without a hint of spitting. I witnessed my Ochiba (the one with the skin issues I've talked about in another thread) flashing yesterday (she was also spitting pellets), so another scrape is on the cards for her sometime this week, and I'll update here if I find anything.

Will do.

For everyone’s info who might read the thread in the future:

Checked my chlorine levels again today and found none. I have been checking every three days and have never found any chlorine.

During this spitting episode, I’ve been checking Ammonia and Nitrate daily and I’m back down to zero of each after a very small spike which lasted 24h.


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I had the heron net off last night for some maintenance so bit the bullet and netted the karashigoi again. Sedated and very gently did a gill scrape and the normal three.

Firstly - big thanks again to Paddy and John who showed me how to do when they visited to help. No way would I have attempted without their demonstration for me.

The gill scrape is petrifying. I’m not sure I’ll ever get used to doing that! The gills themselves are so delicate and look so sensitive.

I got a normal amount of mucous from everywhere. The gills didn’t have much at all, but I did get enough for a scrape.

After pouring over over every slide in minute detail, I didn’t find anything at all. Not a single parasite of any description. I did each slide at both 40x and 100x and spent close two and a half hours studying them going right through the mucous and surrounding water and didn’t find anything at all.

I’m really glad, I was petrified I was going to find gill flukes or something like costia. I have again checked all water parameters and all are still fine.

The Karagoshi itself recovered from the sedation well and is munching away this morning, albeit still spitting some food.

It continued to eat at least 50% of what it grabs and other than the spitting, shows no other symptoms whatsoever of any issues. I will keep observing, but can’t honestly point to anything categoric. Tooth ache or digestive upset may well be the issue, as RS2000 suggested.

I will update this thread next week but at the moment, I am putting it down to something outside of my control.


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