Welcome to Koi Forum. Is this your first visit? Register
Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 21 to 40 of 43

Thread: Koi Development

  1. #21
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion RS2OOO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    South East
    Posts
    5,388
    Thanks / Likes
    12083
    No more before and after comparison pics?

    Come on guys.... Get your albums out.

    AJM.... And you!

  2. #22
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion Ajm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Location
    Durham
    Posts
    10,342
    Thanks / Likes
    19703
    Quote Originally Posted by RS2OOO View Post
    No more before and after comparison pics?

    Come on guys.... Get your albums out.

    AJM.... And you!
    Nowt to show on mine mate very poor year with temps filter changes slight NPS ect . hoping for better things next year tho . Starting off in a lot stronger place

    Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
    Freddyboy the legend

    "we are water keepers first"

    Johnathan

  3. #23
    Senior Member Rank = Kyusai Alburglar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Location
    Dover Kent
    Posts
    1,008
    Thanks / Likes
    1497
    I was never organised enough to take good pics. I will do from now on.
    Kikusui, Beni Kikokuryu, Hariwake, Sanke, Yotsujiro, Doitsu Aka Bekko, Purachina & Mukashi Ogon.

  4. #24
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion RS2OOO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    South East
    Posts
    5,388
    Thanks / Likes
    12083
    Quote Originally Posted by Ajm View Post
    Nowt to show on mine mate very poor year with temps filter changes slight NPS ect . hoping for better things next year tho . Starting off in a lot stronger place

    Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk

    That's no excuse - Just post some side by side comparisons of ones that have done crap, then we can look back next year

    Unless your like me and tend not to bother bowling the crap ones!

    Here's my Shusui who doesn't eat or grow - Purchased at 16cm in 2018. Need to do a measure up to see if its broken 40cm yet!!!!

    Oofuchi, 2018 and 16cm:





    And Summer 2021, the last time it actually came close enough to the surface to get into a photo (back right). Now has so many shimis the whole top of it is black:


  5. Thanks davethefish1 Thanked / Liked this Post
  6. #25
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion Ajm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Location
    Durham
    Posts
    10,342
    Thanks / Likes
    19703
    Quote Originally Posted by RS2OOO View Post
    That's no excuse - Just post some side by side comparisons of ones that have done crap, then we can look back next year

    Unless your like me and tend not to bother bowling the crap ones!

    Here's my Shusui who doesn't eat or grow - Purchased at 16cm in 2018. Need to do a measure up to see if its broken 40cm yet!!!!

    Oofuchi, 2018 and 16cm:





    And Summer 2021, the last time it actually came close enough to the surface to get into a photo (back right). Now has so many shimis the whole top of it is black:

    I'll get it sorted mate lol . Here a couple I have to hand

    . Both taken may ish I believe and then just a couple weeks back . Chag is a byer Oakley line . And midorgoi no idea on breeder I got it from exclusively koi

    Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
    Freddyboy the legend

    "we are water keepers first"

    Johnathan

  7. Thanks samp09, RS2OOO Thanked / Liked this Post
  8. #26
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion Ajm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Location
    Durham
    Posts
    10,342
    Thanks / Likes
    19703
    Other pic

    Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
    Freddyboy the legend

    "we are water keepers first"

    Johnathan

  9. Thanks davethefish1, samp09, RS2OOO Thanked / Liked this Post
  10. #27
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion davethefish1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Bedworth
    Posts
    4,540
    Thanks / Likes
    9398
    Quote Originally Posted by Ajm View Post
    I'll get it sorted mate lol . Here a couple I have to hand

    . Both taken may ish I believe and then just a couple weeks back . Chag is a byer Oakley line . And midorgoi no idea on breeder I got it from exclusively koi

    Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
    chag looks to have made some good growth mate
    and the reticulation looks good too

  11. Thanks samp09, Ajm Thanked / Liked this Post
  12. #28
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion davethefish1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Bedworth
    Posts
    4,540
    Thanks / Likes
    9398
    here's another from my measure up this year...

    Izumiya Yamabuki male
    bought from aurora koi in april 42cm at sansai
    October now at 59cm



  13. Thanks samp09, Ajm, RS2OOO, Mikeh83 Thanked / Liked this Post
  14. #29
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion davethefish1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Bedworth
    Posts
    4,540
    Thanks / Likes
    9398
    And my marusei hi utsuri bought from the queni event at the end of march at 36cm
    October at 56cm


  15. Thanks samp09, Ajm, Djstiles999, Twhitenosugar, RS2OOO, Maddog1 Thanked / Liked this Post
  16. #30
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion RS2OOO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    South East
    Posts
    5,388
    Thanks / Likes
    12083
    Love both of those. I like it when the Yamabuki go like yours has, but no idea what to look for to get one that does that.

    The Hi Utsuri still got improvement to come, look at the pigment in the centres of the scales. It will deepen for sure.

  17. Thanks davethefish1 Thanked / Liked this Post
  18. #31
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion davethefish1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Bedworth
    Posts
    4,540
    Thanks / Likes
    9398
    Quote Originally Posted by RS2OOO View Post
    Love both of those. I like it when the Yamabuki go like yours has, but no idea what to look for to get one that does that.

    The Hi Utsuri still got improvement to come, look at the pigment in the centres of the scales. It will deepen for sure.

    thanks, i'd seen a lot of very average yamabuki's pretty poor tbh...
    and wanted an izumiya one for the bloodline after seeing them on a youtube video



    the hi utsuri is female so not as vibrant as the males when young, but should get better with age....hopefully.
    Last edited by davethefish1; 05-11-2022 at 05:42 PM.

  19. Thanks RS2OOO Thanked / Liked this Post
  20. #32
    Senior Member Rank = Rokusai Naoki Atsumi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2020
    Location
    Tokyo Japan
    Posts
    443
    Thanks / Likes
    300
    Last time I gave you some success stories, can I also give you some failure stories?
    I had experienced some good results in my early twenties before I moved to the UK, and from there I had at one point set my sights on becoming a reseller.
    The challenge was how to find inexpensive KOIs and grow them, as they did not have the financial resources at that time.

    This SHOWA had been on the KOI UK Maurice Cox's web page for a long time, but I found it in a Japanese garden centre at the time, about 11cm and priced at less than £2.

    I thought it must have been a great find when I found it amongst dozens of swimming in a school, but after three years of growing it to about 58 cm, it was still an inexpensive fish.
    Also, the body shape was not such that further size could be desired.
    What I've experienced here is that lottery jackpots and breeders misjudge weren't happen very often.
    Nevertheless, this KOI eventually made its way to the UK and Dennis sold it for around £250, but what I had originally envisaged was that it would be a higher class SHOWA.
    Last edited by Naoki Atsumi; 08-11-2022 at 12:24 AM.

  21. Thanks davethefish1, Mikeh83 Thanked / Liked this Post
  22. #33
    Senior Member Rank = Rokusai Naoki Atsumi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2020
    Location
    Tokyo Japan
    Posts
    443
    Thanks / Likes
    300
    On the other hand, this KOI was also a TOSAI, which was about 13 cm when I bought it and cost £120 in British currency, an expensive expense for me at the time.

    This one looked quite promising to me, one of the Hiroshima SAKAI two-furrowed breedings that were starting to appear at the time. I had been informed that their two-furrowed breeding was an experimental trial and that they would sell out all TOSAI without selecting TATEGOI, so I thought that might be able to get a top of the range SHOWA for the price of 20000 yen, which was inexpensive for that aim but still quite a lot of money for me.

    I had been growing them for 3 years and it was almost 65cm long and as you can see, it ended up feeling like a eternally TATEGOI.
    The experience I gained there was that glossy SUMI looks high quality on the outside, but without deeper consideration it will not hold up when it eventually grows bigger. Also, the quality of the BENI seemed to have been given more colour enhancers before display and was faked so that the true quality was not known.
    Last edited by Naoki Atsumi; 07-11-2022 at 10:58 PM.

  23. Thanks deejaysmi, Feline, davethefish1 Thanked / Liked this Post
  24. #34
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion davethefish1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Bedworth
    Posts
    4,540
    Thanks / Likes
    9398
    Quote Originally Posted by Naoki Atsumi View Post
    Last time I gave you some success stories, can I also give you some failure stories?
    I had experienced some good results in my early twenties before I moved to the UK, and from there I had at one point set my sights on becoming a reseller.
    The challenge was how to find inexpensive KOIs and grow them, as they did not have the financial resources at that time.

    This SHOWA had been on the KOI UK Maurice Cox's web page for a long time, but I found it in a Japanese garden centre at the time, about 11cm and priced at less than £2.

    I thought it must have been a great find when I found it amongst dozens of swimming in a school, but after three years of growing it to about 58 cm, it was still an inexpensive fish.
    Also, the body shape was not such that further size could be desired.
    What I've experienced here is that lottery jackpots and breeders misjudge weren't happen very often.
    Nevertheless, this KOI eventually made its way to the UK and Dennis sold it for around £250, but what I had originally envisaged was that it would be a higher class SHOWA.

    i can see why you might choose this fish based on pattern...
    but the tail is way too thin at tosai and plainly still at sansai.

    i'm as guilty as most valuing pattern before body and size.
    but i do take them into consideration.

  25. Thanks EME101 Thanked / Liked this Post
  26. #35
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion samp09's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Location
    Suffolk
    Posts
    2,969
    Thanks / Likes
    5955
    Quote Originally Posted by Naoki Atsumi View Post
    On the other hand, this KOI was also a TOSAI, which was about 13 cm when I bought it and cost £120 in British currency, an expensive expense for me at the time.

    This one looked quite promising to me, one of the Hiroshima SAKAI two-furrowed breedings that were starting to appear at the time. I had been informed that their two-furrowed breeding was an experimental trial and that they would sell out all TOSAI without selecting TATEGOI, so I thought that might be able to get a top of the range SHOWA for the price of 20000 yen, which was inexpensive for that aim but still quite a lot of money for me.

    I had been growing them for 3 years and it was almost 65cm long and as you can see, it ended up feeling like a eternally TATEGOI.
    The experience I gained there was that glossy SUMI looks high quality on the outside, but without deeper consideration it will not hold up when it eventually grows bigger. Also, the quality of the BENI seemed to have been given more colour enhancers before display and was faked so that the true quality was not known.
    How long did you keep this fish for? Many Showa nowadays can drop lots of sumi in the early years and come back at a later stage to fully develop the fish, I know Isa Showa can often drop sumi at Tosai/Nisai that will come back much thicker in Yonsai/Gosai. I have had this with one of mine, the spring I got it as a Nisai, more and more sumi came through, but as the water warmed up it fell off with more than it had started with, then a year later it started coming through in Spring again and continued to do so until the water got around 20. I am hoping for a similar story this coming spring to help to develop the fish.
    Last edited by samp09; 08-11-2022 at 09:41 PM.

  27. Thanks davethefish1, RS2OOO, EME101, Ajm Thanked / Liked this Post
  28. #36
    Senior Member Rank = Rokusai Naoki Atsumi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2020
    Location
    Tokyo Japan
    Posts
    443
    Thanks / Likes
    300
    Quote Originally Posted by davethefish1 View Post
    i can see why you might choose this fish based on pattern...
    but the tail is way too thin at tosai and plainly still at sansai.

    i'm as guilty as most valuing pattern before body and size.
    but i do take them into consideration.
    To begin with, this SHOWA was an 11 cm dwarf NISAI in the spring.
    The policy for raising it might have been to give it a colour enhancer and let it reach its peak at about 30 or 35 cm with SHIMEGAI, but that was not my forte.
    In any case, I think it was useful for the improvement of my own experience of feeding skills that such a result was obtained in that I was able to draw out the maximum potential in terms of size even with such a miniaturised KOI.

    Quote Originally Posted by samp09 View Post
    How long did you keep this fish for? Many Showa nowadays can drop lots of sumi in the early years and come back at a later stage to fully develop the fish, I know Isa Showa can often drop sumi at Tosai/Nisai that will come back much thicker in Yonsai/Gosai. I have had this with one of mine, the spring I got it as a Nisai, more and more sumi came through, but as the water warmed up it fell off with more than it had started with, then a year later it started coming through in Spring again and continued to do so until the water got around 20. I am hoping for a similar story this coming spring to help to develop the fish.
    I think it was YONSAI at the time of this photo. The recent fixation of the TSUBOZUMI tendency in the ISA has been a remarkable development, and it is a difficult challenge to know the SUMI quality of individual TOSAI without knowing the tendencies of the OYAGOI themselves or their sibling KOI, but it is often said that the MOTOGURO is one of the criteria. This is not a SHOWA, but a SHIROUTSURI, and I have listed the SUMI qualities in my own way from the best ones, but as a result, the popular belief that the thickest strut of the pectoral fin is of better SUMI quality if it is not stained black seems to be not quite wrong.

    The main principle of choosing KOI with a TSUBOZUMI tendency, which springs from a white background, over KASANEZUMI in that one should not be deceived by shiny SUMI seems to be correct.

    Based on these factors, This type of TOSAI is probably what is desired, but in the first place, a SHOWA of this quality will not be available on the market as a TOSAI, and I feel that investing over £500 or £800 in a TOSAI is not a good way to play.

    This person is also aiming to make a large size after making a small autumn TOSAI into a JUNBO TOSAI himself, I can imagine that the amount of investment for each TOSAI KOIs is considerably suppressed from the fact that he is collecting exclude very famous breeder but from a place where people in the know.
    Last edited by Naoki Atsumi; 09-11-2022 at 10:10 AM.

  29. #37
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion davethefish1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Bedworth
    Posts
    4,540
    Thanks / Likes
    9398
    Koshiji showa from March to October 38cm to 58cm




  30. Thanks Maddog1, RS2OOO Thanked / Liked this Post
  31. #38
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion davethefish1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Bedworth
    Posts
    4,540
    Thanks / Likes
    9398
    Hiroi Ginrin Kohaku 2019 to 2022 24cm to 64cm


  32. Thanks Ajm, RS2OOO, samp09, Naoki Atsumi Thanked / Liked this Post
  33. #39
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion davethefish1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Bedworth
    Posts
    4,540
    Thanks / Likes
    9398
    Yamazaki Ochiba Shigure 2019 to 2022 38cm to 65cm


  34. Thanks samp09 Thanked / Liked this Post
  35. #40
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion Ajm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Location
    Durham
    Posts
    10,342
    Thanks / Likes
    19703
    In absolute love with the kohaku!!!!

    Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
    Freddyboy the legend

    "we are water keepers first"

    Johnathan

  36. Thanks davethefish1, RS2OOO, samp09 Thanked / Liked this Post
 

 
Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
All times are GMT +1. The time now is 10:22 AM. Online Koi Mag Forum
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.3
Copyright © 2022 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.

vBulletin Improved By vBFoster® (Lite Version), © UltimateScheme, Ltd.