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  1. #1
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion davethefish1's Avatar
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    Energy saving ideas!

    riding on the back of the current rash of energy threads,
    thought it might be a good idea to share ways to save, or offset the upcoming energy increases.

    not just ponds, but energy anywhere in the house that will help off set the cost of the pond...
    here's my top 2....


    1)
    i've recently added a socket to my heater for a timer so i can run it on economy 7 only.
    as it is only 7p/kWh.
    the pond currently loses about 0.5°C during the day and makes it back up overnight,
    but isn't using peak rate electric at all now.

    2)
    having a job convincing the missus that this is a good idea, but it is a no brainer really...
    remove the 9.5 kw electric shower and swap the standard hot water cylinder for an unvented hot water cylinder, and add a thermostatic shower mixer.
    parts come in around £800 all in.

    4 people in a house 10min shower each day,
    40 mins a day x 9.5KW shower x 365 days = 2311kWh x 27p kWh = £624.15

    but it will save £500 a year, by cutting the annual £600 electric shower bill by 5/6ths down to £100
    by using a gas boiler to heat the water at 1/6th the cost of electricity....




    Last edited by davethefish1; 26-01-2022 at 09:47 PM.

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  3. #2
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Supreme Champion john1's Avatar
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    Plus you get more water pressure useing the gas boiler.
    John

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  5. #3
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion davethefish1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by john1 View Post
    Plus you get more water pressure useing the gas boiler.
    definately

    electric showers have to slow the flow rate so much even at 9.5 KW.
    the indirect unvented cylinder will run on mains pressure through a pressure reducer @ 3.5 bar.
    but my mains supply will barely meet that anyway...

    the bonus is it will boost all my hot water to mains pressure, and free up space in the loft when i remove the tank for the standard cylinder.
    and make it more thermally efficient not losing heat to the water tank in the loft...

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  7. #4
    Moderator Rank = Supreme Champion Feline's Avatar
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    Definitely worth considering solar energy.
    I have the pond ASHP timer on to come on at 10pm which is when our cheap rate begins, and to turn off at 4pm which is when the solar output drops. On warmer days the heat pump doesn’t need to come on much, and on the colder days it tends to be sunnier so we run at least partly on solar. In another month the solar output will increase to mostly cover the running of the pond anyway.
    In the summer the hot water is heated via the immersion heater on an iBoost device that uses solar only when we have excess production. The rest of the time the gas does the hot water.

    We are considering upgrading the car charger to one that can work intelligently the same way as the iBoost does- so it could vary the charge rate of the car according to how much excess energy production we have at any one time. In the winter the Tesla can take more power than we can generate, so it’s mostly getting charged on cheap rate in the night rather than on solar. The Prius EV charges at a slower rate by default, so I generally do charge that on solar in the daytime.

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  9. #5
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion davethefish1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Feline View Post
    Definitely worth considering solar energy.
    I have the pond ASHP timer on to come on at 10pm which is when our cheap rate begins, and to turn off at 4pm which is when the solar output drops. On warmer days the heat pump doesn’t need to come on much, and on the colder days it tends to be sunnier so we run at least partly on solar. In another month the solar output will increase to mostly cover the running of the pond anyway.
    In the summer the hot water is heated via the immersion heater on an iBoost device that uses solar only when we have excess production. The rest of the time the gas does the hot water.

    We are considering upgrading the car charger to one that can work intelligently the same way as the iBoost does- so it could vary the charge rate of the car according to how much excess energy production we have at any one time. In the winter the Tesla can take more power than we can generate, so it’s mostly getting charged on cheap rate in the night rather than on solar. The Prius EV charges at a slower rate by default, so I generally do charge that on solar in the daytime.

    doesn't make much financial sense now though, unless you were rich enough to get in on the ground floor 10 years ago...bit like pyramid selling
    all you get now is 1p to 5.5p per kWh returned to the national grid....

    it says online an average 4kw PV system installation now costs £6000 today,
    with a £90 to £250 return each year, it will take 25 to 66 years just to pay for it's self...
    i won't even be alive by then to make money on it
    Last edited by davethefish1; 27-01-2022 at 10:25 AM.

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    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Jussai NickK-UK's Avatar
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    When our 25y/o boiler died - we ditched the open hot water system, ripping out the hot water tank and replaced the CH and HW with a combi (Worscester Bosch 32CDI) slightly upsized from the 28cdi quote at the time. New rain shower added onto the 22mm pipes - happy wife. 10 years on and it's still going strong. Didn't look back and no regrets.

    The garage is getting a 30A supply. This has some interesting options in future in addition to the pond, it could support an electric car charging port (30A is basically a 7KW charging port) and even allow the installation of heat pumps in the garage.
    Eco Pond: 13,000 litres, 20K+ lph Airlifts, 1300l anoxic, Solum 16. No pump. 58W total.

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  13. #7
    Senior Member Rank = Jussai Twhitenosugar's Avatar
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    My energy saving tips are:

    Don't have the heating come on through the day or at night, just mornings and evenings...

    Put a jumper on and wear thick socks if you feel cold at home, rather than turning heating back on/up.

    Turn off anything on standby that you aren't going to use.

    Turn off/down things that aren't strictly necessary, eg. I've unplugged my amalgam UV for now, and turned my shower filter right down to min.

    Turn pond heaters down in really cold temps. After all if the fish can survive in unheated ponds, dropping to 13C gradually, is not going to hurt them and realistically you will only miss out on a bit of growth that can be caught up on when milder weather returns.

    I've turned my grow-on in my garage down to 18C (from 22c) and the heater comes on a lot less frequently now. I'll turn it back up once day time figures are closer to upper singles and lower double digits. I'll also reduce how long the light stays on for from 12 hours to 10 hours. Marginal gains all add up.

    Turn the central heating stat down to 19, or by a degree if above this but you think 19 is too cold.

    Get a smart stat that stops the heating coming on when no one is home.

    Turned off rads and close the door in any room you don't use much.

    Get walls and lofts insulated if you have still not got round to it.

    Open curtains when it's light for solar gain and draw them when it gets dark to keep the heat in. If possible tuck the curtain in behind the rad so the heat enters the room rather than the window.

    Put draft excluders in around drafty doors and windows.

    If you have a gym membership plan your routine so you have showers there rather than at home (or the office if they have facilities there).

    Go to the pub more - it's free heating and socialising is good for mental health (I'll skip the bit about alcohol being bad for you Energy saving ideas!).


    Sent from my Pixel 4a (5G) using Tapatalk
    13,000L fibreglassed raised pond with window

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  15. #8
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion Ajm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twhitenosugar View Post
    My energy saving tips are:

    Don't have the heating come on through the day or at night, just mornings and evenings...

    Put a jumper on and wear thick socks if you feel cold at home, rather than turning heating back on/up.

    Turn off anything on standby that you aren't going to use.

    Turn off/down things that aren't strictly necessary, eg. I've unplugged my amalgam UV for now, and turned my shower filter right down to min.

    Turn pond heaters down in really cold temps. After all if the fish can survive in unheated ponds, dropping to 13C gradually, is not going to hurt them and realistically you will only miss out on a bit of growth that can be caught up on when milder weather returns.

    I've turned my grow-on in my garage down to 18C (from 22c) and the heater comes on a lot less frequently now. I'll turn it back up once day time figures are closer to upper singles and lower double digits. I'll also reduce how long the light stays on for from 12 hours to 10 hours. Marginal gains all add up.

    Turn the central heating stat down to 19, or by a degree if above this but you think 19 is too cold.

    Get a smart stat that stops the heating coming on when no one is home.

    Turned off rads and close the door in any room you don't use much.

    Get walls and lofts insulated if you have still not got round to it.

    Open curtains when it's light for solar gain and draw them when it gets dark to keep the heat in. If possible tuck the curtain in behind the rad so the heat enters the room rather than the window.

    Put draft excluders in around drafty doors and windows.

    If you have a gym membership plan your routine so you have showers there rather than at home (or the office if they have facilities there).

    Go to the pub more - it's free heating and socialising is good for mental health (I'll skip the bit about alcohol being bad for you Energy saving ideas!).


    Sent from my Pixel 4a (5G) using Tapatalk
    Left out drink cold coffee ? Kettle costs a fortune in this house

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    Freddyboy the legend

    "we are water keepers first"

    Johnathan

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  17. #9
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Jussai NickK-UK's Avatar
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    The majority of electrical bills are the CH pump and the refrigerator. Followed by the TV, washing machine/dishwasher/tumberdryer etc. A heat pump dryer is more expensive to purchase but operationally is cheaper - but in summer hang stuff out in the garden.

    Curtains across the doors (seems old fashioned) and the little brush excluders on the under side of the doors works really well. Shutters are very good but remember to open them so that the window area gets dehumidified with day warmth.

    We have our heating set to 15 degC during the day. Then only turn it up if we notice. Typically the monitors and computer are enough to keep a room warm with the door closed.
    Eco Pond: 13,000 litres, 20K+ lph Airlifts, 1300l anoxic, Solum 16. No pump. 58W total.

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  19. #10
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion davethefish1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twhitenosugar View Post
    My energy saving tips are:

    Don't have the heating come on through the day or at night, just mornings and evenings...

    Put a jumper on and wear thick socks if you feel cold at home, rather than turning heating back on/up.
    I've turned the heating schedule down (schneider wiser eco)
    but have 'home workers' since covid and turning the heating off during the day would cause divorce!

    but i've taken to wearing a fleece body warmer around the house during the day...
    as i feel the cold now i'm old and decrepit

    Quote Originally Posted by Twhitenosugar View Post
    My energy saving tips are:

    Get walls and lofts insulated if you have still not got round to it.
    done the cavity wall insulation a couple of years ago, along with a new boiler...
    made a big difference! saw our gas bill drop by 50%

    to be fair our electric usage is 6 times our gas.
    any changes need to be at targeted at electric usage.
    our annual gas bill is about £320 a year but electric is £1920.
    and that is set to double!
    Last edited by davethefish1; 27-01-2022 at 12:39 PM.

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  21. #11
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion davethefish1's Avatar
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    not being very technical around washing machines, tumble dryers ect...lol

    missus told me ages ago the LG washing machine and tumble dryer can't be put on a timer as its all computerised...
    just found the manual online and it has it's own piggin' built in timer delayed start function!

    so thats two more high cost 3 kWh items to be set on delay to run on economy 7

    edit: dishwasher as well....
    Last edited by davethefish1; 28-01-2022 at 09:56 AM.

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  23. #12
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Jussai NickK-UK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davethefish1 View Post
    not being very technical around washing machines, tumble dryers ect...lol

    missus told me ages ago the LG washing machine and tumble dryer can't be put on a timer as its all computerised...
    just found the manual online and it has it's own piggin' built in timer delayed start function!

    so thats two more high cost 3 kWh items to be set on delay to run on economy 7

    edit: dishwasher as well....

    Bosch washing machine and tumble dryer can be set to complete by a specific time (you have to set it as a time delay for the end of the cycle but that stops it needing to keep a realtime clock powered).

    Condenser tumble dryers are faster but use at least 2x the electricity. The tumble dryer stops when the air is down to a specific humidity (ie clothes are dry) so the time is the maximum time it takes, otherwise the dryer finishes and stops earlier. You can still set the dumb timed program (the clothes may or may not be dry or creased as a result) but the modern appliances have some good features that save energy and resources.
    Eco Pond: 13,000 litres, 20K+ lph Airlifts, 1300l anoxic, Solum 16. No pump. 58W total.

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  25. #13
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion davethefish1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NickK-UK View Post
    Bosch washing machine and tumble dryer can be set to complete by a specific time (you have to set it as a time delay for the end of the cycle but that stops it needing to keep a realtime clock powered).
    i just found that out the hard way...
    the delay isn't to when it starts, it's what time it finishes including the cycle.

    so need to add a couple of hours extra for the cycle to make sure it starts during economy 7...

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    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion davethefish1's Avatar
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    All this energy saving could soon be for nothing....
    the missus wants a flippin' lazy spa now....

    a mate has just got rid of his....
    his missus and kids were in it all day every day for 5 months last summer....
    then he got a £2,000 electric bill!

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    Senior Member Rank = Gosai Dom G20's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davethefish1 View Post
    All this energy saving could soon be for nothing....
    the missus wants a flippin' lazy spa now....

    a mate has just got rid of his....
    his missus and kids were in it all day every day for 5 months last summer....
    then he got a £2,000 electric bill!
    Ouchhhhhhh! I mean that bill is painful - we don’t have a leg to stand on though do we with our money pit ponds!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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  31. #16
    Junior Member Rank = Fry Luminosity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davethefish1 View Post
    doesn't make much financial sense now though, unless you were rich enough to get in on the ground floor 10 years ago...bit like pyramid selling
    all you get now is 1p to 5.5p per kWh returned to the national grid....

    it says online an average 4kw PV system installation now costs £6000 today,
    with a £90 to £250 return each year, it will take 25 to 66 years just to pay for it's self...
    i won't even be alive by then to make money on it
    A society grows great when old men plant trees in whose shade they know they shall never sit.

    Not really relevant but i thought it made me sound clever

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  33. #17
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion davethefish1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ajm View Post
    Left out drink cold coffee ? Kettle costs a fortune in this house

    Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
    next cooker we get the halogen hob is out! and gas hob is back in.... 1/6th the cost...
    and a good old fashioned whistling kettle to go on the hob too

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  35. #18
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion davethefish1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luminosity View Post
    A society grows great when old men plant trees in whose shade they know they shall never sit.

    Not really relevant but i thought it made me sound clever
    plant away!
    my roof is ready for you to pay for my PV solar installation,
    you can have your money back in 50 years...

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  37. #19
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion Ajm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davethefish1 View Post
    next cooker we get the halogen hob is out! and gas hob is back in.... 1/6th the cost...
    and a good old fashioned whistling kettle to go on the hob too
    Thought about still a kettle on the fire to keep warm all day lol

    Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
    Freddyboy the legend

    "we are water keepers first"

    Johnathan

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  39. #20
    Senior Member Rank = Mature Champion smartin's Avatar
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    My pond was actually warmer than the inside of my house in some rooms of late our dual fuel burner has been flat out, me and the mrs been huddled with a blanket each in the living room watching the TV, making my own kindling but my wood supply is running low now, to buy kindling is stupid money, our local fuel station sells a bag enough to light about 3 fires for a £4.99 a 10k bag of coal for £9.99 and a silly bag of logs for £8.99 and firelighters for £2.99 - can get the same bag of coal at Asda for £4, firelighters for 49p from home bargains, logs at the forestry for £7 - you fill your own good sized net of pre chopped seasoned wood.
    2200 gallons,infinity window,BD
    Evolve 40k combi,amalgam UV
    2x20k pondxpert, Skimmer,
    shower,ASHP

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