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Thread: Envirex

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    Senior Member Rank = Adult Champion smartin's Avatar
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    Envirex

    Hi All,

    well after some positive reviews both on here and online i purchased some of this, albeit 400g delivered at £21.95, anyhow after cleaning my filters and then adding CT at 15% prior to adding Fluke M has resulted in my filters taking a big hit, Ammonia has been at 0.5 / 1.0 all week, food has been cut back and water changes have taken place, Ammonia drops to 0.5 but within a day rises to 1, i added Envirex yesterday at the same dosage as if a new pond, today i checked my water parameters and they are exactly the same as yesterday so no change at all.
    Now i appreciate there is no miracle product out there for Ammonia but this product does claim to reduce Ammonia and Nitrates...... it does not claim how long it will take however and i appreciate its only been 24 hours but the Ammonia has not changed at all and there is not a trace of Nitrite so the filters do not look remotely ready to start converting but appear stable to cope with some Ammonia hence holding at 1....... i have a trickle going, i also turned the pumps right down and had the UV off for the Fluke treatment and for the Envirex to get into the media, i will let you know when my Ammonia starts to reduce and the Nitrites show then we can all take a view if this product has helped or not, it is my belief however that this product does contain a flocculent of some description as my water does appear to be clearer today so maybe floc / clay based ?? watch this space...... thanks Steve.


    2200 gallons, infinity window, BD
    Evolve 4000 combi amalgam UV
    10k,20k AF pumps
    Skimmer trickle.

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    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion RS2OOO's Avatar
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    Will be interesting to see your daily test results Steve as Envirex claims also to reduce phosphates and nitrates as well. LFH have a great reputation and definitely not known for selling snake oil.

    I think this is incredibly unlikely but I also wondered if it somehow reduces the toxic effect of Ammonia yet it still gets picked up on test kits? Probably not tbh.

    Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

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    Senior Member Rank = Yonsai jphamill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smartin View Post
    Hi All,

    well after some positive reviews both on here and online i purchased some of this, albeit 400g delivered at £21.95, anyhow after cleaning my filters and then adding CT at 15% prior to adding Fluke M has resulted in my filters taking a big hit, Ammonia has been at 0.5 / 1.0 all week, food has been cut back and water changes have taken place, Ammonia drops to 0.5 but within a day rises to 1, i added Envirex yesterday at the same dosage as if a new pond, today i checked my water parameters and they are exactly the same as yesterday so no change at all.
    Now i appreciate there is no miracle product out there for Ammonia but this product does claim to reduce Ammonia and Nitrates...... it does not claim how long it will take however and i appreciate its only been 24 hours but the Ammonia has not changed at all and there is not a trace of Nitrite so the filters do not look remotely ready to start converting but appear stable to cope with some Ammonia hence holding at 1....... i have a trickle going, i also turned the pumps right down and had the UV off for the Fluke treatment and for the Envirex to get into the media, i will let you know when my Ammonia starts to reduce and the Nitrites show then we can all take a view if this product has helped or not, it is my belief however that this product does contain a flocculent of some description as my water does appear to be clearer today so maybe floc / clay based ?? watch this space...... thanks Steve.
    Can I ask what exactly is CT and fluke treatment. I googled ct and got a cotswold koi link to cloverleaf cT? But what are the active ingredients ? Is this erythromycin?
    @Feline?
    If these are broad-spectrum antiparasitic/ antibacterials I'm sure they blow the the filter bio activities to smithereens.



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    Senior Member Rank = Adult Champion smartin's Avatar
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    Hi jphamill,

    CT is Chloramine T by Kusuri.... the fluke treatment i used was Fluke M also by Kusuri.... CT is used to reduce fish mucus so that the flukes have nowhere to hide from the treatment, also helps to clean your equipment..... aware that it will effect bacteria good and bad in your filters but was not expecting this effect, its like being back to NPS stage... (New Pond Syndrome)
    Last edited by smartin; 25-09-2020 at 11:53 AM.
    2200 gallons, infinity window, BD
    Evolve 4000 combi amalgam UV
    10k,20k AF pumps
    Skimmer trickle.

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    Senior Member Rank = Adult Champion smartin's Avatar
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    Just in the process of doing a 30% water change.... once refilled i will take an Ammonia reading and will photograph the sample for colour, i will then add around 120g of Envirex to see if this makes any difference, as you know i added a full dose of Envirex on Wednesday using the "new pond dosage" even though its not a new pond at 160g which is for 2000 gallons same as my pond which made no difference so basically in 3 days i would of added 280g of this stuff.
    2200 gallons, infinity window, BD
    Evolve 4000 combi amalgam UV
    10k,20k AF pumps
    Skimmer trickle.

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    Senior Member Rank = Yonsai jphamill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smartin View Post
    Hi jphamill,

    CT is Chloramine T by Kusuri.... the fluke treatment i used was Fluke M also by Kusuri.... CT is used to reduce fish mucus so that the flukes have nowhere to hide from the treatment, also helps to clean your equipment..... aware that it will effect bacteria good and bad in your filters but was not expecting this effect, its like being back to NPS stage... (New Pond Syndrome)
    I've done a bit of reading...
    It releases chlorine and has an antibiotic action of a drug group called sulphonamides. They were widely used before we had penicillin. We refer to them as sulphas.
    I suspect that its a bit of a thermonuclear weapon to small organisms . Like your filter bugs.
    Fluke M is a drug called Flubendazole, its a wormer. I assume not like a broad-spectrum antibiotic. @Feline is the one we must ask on that.
    I wonder though about chloramine reducing mucus, I would have thought the irritating nature would cause them to make more mucus ?


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    Senior Member Rank = Adult Champion smartin's Avatar
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    CT has been used in the world of koi for a fair few years now....... flubendazole is another well known and widely used ingredient for the eradication of flukes.....
    2200 gallons, infinity window, BD
    Evolve 4000 combi amalgam UV
    10k,20k AF pumps
    Skimmer trickle.

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    Senior Member Rank = Hassai Tom Koi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smartin View Post
    CT has been used in the world of koi for a fair few years now....... flubendazole is another well known and widely used ingredient for the eradication of flukes.....
    Steve, PP is best to stuff for removing mucus, I'm told, to allow you to treat Flukes, I'am lead to believe that flukes can get immune to the treatments as well, Flubendazole is very good I'm told as well, Flukes are nasty stuff to eradicate though, Good Luck
    Last edited by Tom Koi; 25-09-2020 at 09:23 PM.

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    Senior Member Rank = Yonsai jphamill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smartin View Post
    CT has been used in the world of koi for a fair few years now....... flubendazole is another well known and widely used ingredient for the eradication of flukes.....
    I found this.

    'Treat and prevent gill flukes

    As a reaction to infection with gill worms fish will make additional mucous."


    So: I suggest this.

    The mucous is a defense reaction from the fish, a millenia old response , this would suggest that mucous is good, therefore I'd look at it this way:
    Leave the mucous membranes alone, spare your filters the chloramine misery. Treat the worm with Flubendazole




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    Senior Member Rank = Hassai Tom Koi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jphamill View Post
    I found this.

    'Treat and prevent gill flukes

    As a reaction to infection with gill worms fish will make additional mucous."


    So: I suggest this.

    The mucous is a defense reaction from the fish, a millenia old response , this would suggest that mucous is good, therefore I'd look at it this way:
    Leave the mucous membranes alone, spare your filters the chloramine misery. Treat the worm with Flubendazole




    Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
    You need to take the mucus off the fish, to enable the fluke treatments to get into the skin of the fish, otherwise flukes just keep returning.

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    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion freddyboy's Avatar
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    i used CT 3 times over the last 2 years. 12 hours before treating with fluke M. to take mucus off the fish. and my water parameters stayed good.
    did nt affect them at all. and it worked both years. it did affect them the water parameters. when i had to nuked the follow on parasite costia. overdosed to get rid. this year. the costia was a nightmare following on 2 weeks later
    after flukes. it also affected the water chemistry balance of the pond.
    fred

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    Senior Member Rank = Adult Champion smartin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Koi View Post
    Steve, PP is best to stuff for removing mucus, I'm told, to allow you to treat Flukes, I'am lead to believe that flukes can get immune to the treatments as well, Flubendazole is very good I'm told as well, Flukes are nasty stuff to eradicate though, Good Luck
    A couple of my fish were too weak to go through a PP treatment, PP will also effect your filters especially after 5 fluke treatments prior, if things were different i might of PP but its too strong a treatment.......
    2200 gallons, infinity window, BD
    Evolve 4000 combi amalgam UV
    10k,20k AF pumps
    Skimmer trickle.

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    Senior Member Rank = Hassai Tom Koi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smartin View Post
    A couple of my fish were too weak to go through a PP treatment, PP will also effect your filters especially after 5 fluke treatments prior, if things were different i might of PP but its too strong a treatment.......

    Oh right, I didn't know sorry Thanks, Hope all goes well for you and your fish.

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    Senior Member Rank = Adult Champion smartin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Koi View Post
    Oh right, I didn't know sorry Thanks, Hope all goes well for you and your fish.
    cheers Tom, no worries ,mate...
    2200 gallons, infinity window, BD
    Evolve 4000 combi amalgam UV
    10k,20k AF pumps
    Skimmer trickle.

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  27. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by smartin View Post
    Hi All,

    well after some positive reviews both on here and online i purchased some of this, albeit 400g delivered at £21.95, anyhow after cleaning my filters and then adding CT at 15% prior to adding Fluke M has resulted in my filters taking a big hit, Ammonia has been at 0.5 / 1.0 all week, food has been cut back and water changes have taken place, Ammonia drops to 0.5 but within a day rises to 1, i added Envirex yesterday at the same dosage as if a new pond, today i checked my water parameters and they are exactly the same as yesterday so no change at all.
    Now i appreciate there is no miracle product out there for Ammonia but this product does claim to reduce Ammonia and Nitrates...... it does not claim how long it will take however and i appreciate its only been 24 hours but the Ammonia has not changed at all and there is not a trace of Nitrite so the filters do not look remotely ready to start converting but appear stable to cope with some Ammonia hence holding at 1....... i have a trickle going, i also turned the pumps right down and had the UV off for the Fluke treatment and for the Envirex to get into the media, i will let you know when my Ammonia starts to reduce and the Nitrites show then we can all take a view if this product has helped or not, it is my belief however that this product does contain a flocculent of some description as my water does appear to be clearer today so maybe floc / clay based ?? watch this space...... thanks Steve.
    I'll put this comment on this thread and the other Envirex thread in case it isn't noticed on this one:

    When I do product tests or evaluations, an important point I make sure is that the product is being used strictly according to the design specifications or manufacturer's instructions.

    The initial dose of Envirex that you put into your pond proved that it works exactly as it should.
    " Ammonia drops to 0.5 but within a day rises to 1"

    It isnít supposed to be a daily ammonia blocker for the ammonia that fish exhale with every respiration cycle whether theyíre being fed or not. Thatís why the first dose reduced the level as itís supposed to do but the fish continued to respire and caused it to rise again because there isnít a working biofilter to remove it and Envirex isnít supposed to re-start a dead biofilter.

    Envirex will make ponds far more hygienic and reduce the chance of disease by providing competitive exclusion for disease causing bugs and secondary opportunistic bugs or fungi. It degrades all types of solid waste matter whilst lowering ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and phosphate and other unwanted substances in the water.

    Envirex is a mix of enzymes and micro-organisms that work together to lower the bacterial count and reduce the levels of unwanted substances and degrade waste. It doesnít contain nitrifying bugs that will re-seed a dead or damaged biofilter. You either have to wait for a damaged biofilter to remature from any surviving bugs that havenít been killed or from the nitrifying bugs that are ubiquitous in the environment. In the case of a fully stocked pond, where you need it to remature more quickly, you should use a filter starter. Envirex wonít speed up either natural maturing or the action of a filter starter.

    The best strategy until the biofilter has rematured is to conduct daily water changes of sufficient size to reduce the current level of ammonia and any future spike in nitrite to acceptable levels.

    I spoke to Paula about this when she phoned about some other stuff and she said you may have been wrongly advised about Envirex by whoever sold it to you. She said that she would be happy for you to phone her as she obviously knows far more about Envirex and its uses than dealers so she can give you correct advice.

    The product information detailing what Envirex is manufactured to do is on the link below and you can go from there to the contact page for Paulaís contact information:
    Products

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