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  1. #1
    Senior Member Rank = Gosai SamuraiJack's Avatar
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    Help/Advice needed

    Good morning all,

    the situation i am in at the moment in short words

    i do not have a microscope and do not know how to scrape, it's on my do list

    pond size 10 X 8 X 3.5 = 1500 Gallons(6819lt)

    15 X small koi (largest is 5 inch)

    12 X Gold fish

    Filter Kockney Koi KV5000, 1 Vortex, 2 Brushes, 3 Jap Mattings, 4 Alfagrogs, 5 Alfagrogs

    Last Water test 25.07.2020

    pH 7- 8
    Ammonia 0
    Nitrite 0

    Feed Coppens OSW 3mm

    2 weeks ago lost one koi, last week another one went all quite keeping to the corner and not feeding, it then recovered after a few days and started eating again, soon as this one recovered another with the same problem followed by another, total of 4, they all looked like recovered as they were feeding and swimming normal until yesterday when the first one gone back in hiding followed by the 2nd, this morning i got up at 5am just to check on them and they still the same, the others came rushing up for feed but they stayed where they were, visually i can not see any spots or frayed fins, i am now thinking that when i get home this afternoon i am going to treat the pond with Tetra MediFin, i'm not a great fan of adding chemicals but i just might have to this time, i was also going to net one out to check more closely buy worried it might do more harm due to stressing it out, i also don't have a separate set up where i can remove them to, i will be grateful for all advice.

    Many Thanks

    Mo



  2. #2
    Senior Member Rank = Jussai g mac's Avatar
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    I would advise against just adding chemicals without knowing what the problem is.I did that at the beginning of the current problems that I have in my pond. Unless you're very lucky it will be ineffective and possibly cause problems if you then need to add something different.
    I was lucky in that another member on here kindly donated a microscope to me, I was then able to diagnose the problems, of which there were plenty.

    If you let us know where you are, it might be that someone can help. Failing that either get yourself a microscope or see if a local koi dealer can help.

    I do wish you luck and hope you can get it sorted pronto.

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  4. #3
    Senior Member Rank = Gosai SamuraiJack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by g mac View Post
    I would advise against just adding chemicals without knowing what the problem is.I did that at the beginning of the current problems that I have in my pond. Unless you're very lucky it will be ineffective and possibly cause problems if you then need to add something different.
    I was lucky in that another member on here kindly donated a microscope to me, I was then able to diagnose the problems, of which there were plenty.

    If you let us know where you are, it might be that someone can help. Failing that either get yourself a microscope or see if a local koi dealer can help.

    I do wish you luck and hope you can get it sorted pronto.
    thank you for the advice, i live in Barking, Essex, a microscope was on my list but been so busy the last few weeks with my younger sister who is still recovering from Covid 19, 60% of her lungs are damaged but she is slowly getting there, plus all the stress at work.

    Mo

  5. #4
    Senior Member Rank = Jussai g mac's Avatar
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    Hope she makes a full recovery, how bloody scary.

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  7. #5
    Senior Member Rank = Gosai SamuraiJack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by g mac View Post
    Hope she makes a full recovery, how bloody scary.
    thank you, it is scary out there, stay safe everyone

  8. #6
    Senior Member Rank = Gosai SamuraiJack's Avatar
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    Update: got the koi out with a net, the only visible sign is the left side of it's mouth which is red and slightly raised, fins and tail look good, that's all I could see, the rest are feeding like crazy and active.

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  10. #7
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion freddyboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SamuraiJack View Post
    Update: got the koi out with a net, the only visible sign is the left side of it's mouth which is red and slightly raised, fins and tail look good, that's all I could see, the rest are feeding like crazy and active.
    hello mate. hope your sister gets well soon. g mac is spot on mate, don t add treatments untill you know what your treating. on the fish with the red mark in or around the mouth, that could be the start of mouth rot.
    or an ulceration. what you need is one of these link. https://www.kusuri.co.uk/kusuri-prod...treatment-kit/
    and here is the insrructions of how to use copy and pasted over

    How To Use

    Kusuri 8 Piece Topical Treatment Kit Instruction Leaflet
    Thank you for purchasing your KUSURI 8 Piece Topical Treatment Kit. Please read carefully the instructions below prior to using this kit.
    Prepare everything before you start, this includes:
    A bowl or container large enough to hold the fish to be treated.
    A wet towel and/or, if available, a clean babies changing mat. Use pond water to prepare these items. A pair of tweezers. (For removing any dead scales if necessary).
    Fill the spray bottle provided with tap water and pump/prime ready for use.
    Have all the kit contents laid out in order of use for quick easy handling.
    Ensure you are wearing the provided surgical gloves, or similar, before starting the treatment.
    Sedation:
    Fill the bowl or container with a measured suitable amount of pond water so that the dorsal fin on the fish to be sedated will be covered. Add 5ml of KUSURI Masuizai Koi Sedate, using the cap for measuring, per 5 litres of pond water. With your fingers spread apart agitate the water for a few seconds to dissipate the Koi Sedate. Place the fish to be treated in the bowl, cover with a net to prevent the fish jumping out. Stay with the fish at ALL times and observe the fish until it rolls on to its side. Remove the net and with your palms under the fish, gently lift out of the solution. If the fish, after a few seconds, is still flapping its tail, place the fish back into the solution for a further 15 seconds. Lift the fish again as before and place on to the prepared wet towel, or if available, a wet, babies changing mat, (ideal for performing this treatment). If outdoors, ensure this procedure is performed in the shade.
    Inspect the fish and decide what areas are to be treated. Carefully place the corners of the wet towel or if on a changing mat, a separate prepared wet towel, over the areas not to be treated, so as to keep the fish moist.
    Perform the following steps, quickly and calmly, within a 5-10 minute window. Do not allow the fish to stay out of the water any longer than required.
    To avoid any cross contamination, only dip either end of a cotton bud applicator in to any of the solutions ONCE.
    Cleaning the wound:
    Carefully check around the ulcer. With a pair of tweezers, gently pull and remove any dead scales. If after gently pulling the scales they do not release easily, this means they are NOT dead and should be left. Using a cotton bud carefully wipe and dry the wound site. Using a fresh cotton bud apply KUSURI Roccal Wound Cleaner on and around the wound site. Leave for 10-15 seconds. Using a fresh cotton bud dry the wound site.
    Sterilising the wound:
    Using a fresh cotton bud apply KUSURI Anti-Bac to the wound. Pay careful attention to work the solution around any damaged scales, avoiding disturbance to the good scales. Allow to dry and using a clean cotton bud apply a second application. Before this dries move quickly to the next stage.
    Dressing the wound:
    While still wet, carefully sprinkle, KUSURI Oraheasive Powder on to the wound site. Gently blow off any excess powder. Using the filled spray bottle (tap water), lightly mist the wound site and apply a second coating of Oraheasive Powder, again gently blowing off any excess powder.
    This process will form a clear skin like coating over the wound site.
    With gloved hand, spray a finger with the tap water, and gently smooth over the skin forming to leave a neat finish.
    Sealing the dressing:
    Carefully blow over the area so it semi dries before using a clean cotton bud to apply KUSURI Top Coat Sealer to the formed skin area. Blow gently to evaporate and dry the area.
    Returning the fish to the pond:
    Once all areas to be treated have been completed, return the fish to the pond by gently supporting from underneath. Hold the fish in to the flow of an air stone until she recovers. If the fish is large enough, place a finger in to her mouth and stroke the roof area to encourage the fish to swallow and gulp. This allows the highly oxygenated water to pass over the gills, speeding up the recovery.
    Note:
    If a fish sedates quickly, it is usual that the fish recovers out of sedation quickly. If the fish takes longer to sedate it will usually take longer to recover out of sedation too.
    This treatment can be repeated after 3-4 days if healing is not occurring, still red. Observing the Koi is critical in deciding whether further treatment is required. Within 3-4 days depending on water temperature you should see signs of the wound site turning from red (infected) to pink (new skin tissue generation occurring) to white (healed wound). It is always a difficult decision whether to net and bowl the fish for observation after a few days as this procedure can damage the fish, undoing the healing process that has occurred. If the wound site is under the fish and difficult to observe, leave it for 7 days before re-examining the Koi in a bowl or a polythene bag.
    Disclaimer:
    KUSURI 8 Piece Topical Treatment Kit is to be used at the owners discretion. Kusuri Products Limited will not hold themselves responsible for any misuse. Depending on the health and strength of the fish being treated, fish loses during this process can happen. Kusuri Products Limited will not be held responsible if this occurs.
    Replacement kit components are available at: Kusuri Koi Carp, Aquarium and Pond Products or your local Kusuri Retailer.
    You can also print the instructions here
    look on ebay or elsewhere they used to be £42.00

    hope that helps mate.
    fred

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  12. #8
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Adult Champion anne's Avatar
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    Wishing your sister a Speedy recovery Mo......

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  14. #9
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Supreme Champion Frimley Koi keeper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SamuraiJack View Post
    thank you for the advice, i live in Barking, Essex, a microscope was on my list but been so busy the last few weeks with my younger sister who is still recovering from Covid 19, 60% of her lungs are damaged but she is slowly getting there, plus all the stress at work.

    Mo
    Sorry to hear that Mo, hope she recovers fully and quickly. And hope you get your pond issues sorted too.

    Good luck

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  16. #10
    Senior Member Rank = Gosai SamuraiJack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by freddyboy View Post
    hello mate. hope your sister gets well soon. g mac is spot on mate, don t add treatments untill you know what your treating. on the fish with the red mark in or around the mouth, that could be the start of mouth rot.
    or an ulceration. what you need is one of these link. https://www.kusuri.co.uk/kusuri-prod...treatment-kit/
    and here is the insrructions of how to use copy and pasted over

    How To Use

    Kusuri 8 Piece Topical Treatment Kit Instruction Leaflet
    Thank you for purchasing your KUSURI 8 Piece Topical Treatment Kit. Please read carefully the instructions below prior to using this kit.
    Prepare everything before you start, this includes:
    A bowl or container large enough to hold the fish to be treated.
    A wet towel and/or, if available, a clean babies changing mat. Use pond water to prepare these items. A pair of tweezers. (For removing any dead scales if necessary).
    Fill the spray bottle provided with tap water and pump/prime ready for use.
    Have all the kit contents laid out in order of use for quick easy handling.
    Ensure you are wearing the provided surgical gloves, or similar, before starting the treatment.
    Sedation:
    Fill the bowl or container with a measured suitable amount of pond water so that the dorsal fin on the fish to be sedated will be covered. Add 5ml of KUSURI Masuizai Koi Sedate, using the cap for measuring, per 5 litres of pond water. With your fingers spread apart agitate the water for a few seconds to dissipate the Koi Sedate. Place the fish to be treated in the bowl, cover with a net to prevent the fish jumping out. Stay with the fish at ALL times and observe the fish until it rolls on to its side. Remove the net and with your palms under the fish, gently lift out of the solution. If the fish, after a few seconds, is still flapping its tail, place the fish back into the solution for a further 15 seconds. Lift the fish again as before and place on to the prepared wet towel, or if available, a wet, babies changing mat, (ideal for performing this treatment). If outdoors, ensure this procedure is performed in the shade.
    Inspect the fish and decide what areas are to be treated. Carefully place the corners of the wet towel or if on a changing mat, a separate prepared wet towel, over the areas not to be treated, so as to keep the fish moist.
    Perform the following steps, quickly and calmly, within a 5-10 minute window. Do not allow the fish to stay out of the water any longer than required.
    To avoid any cross contamination, only dip either end of a cotton bud applicator in to any of the solutions ONCE.
    Cleaning the wound:
    Carefully check around the ulcer. With a pair of tweezers, gently pull and remove any dead scales. If after gently pulling the scales they do not release easily, this means they are NOT dead and should be left. Using a cotton bud carefully wipe and dry the wound site. Using a fresh cotton bud apply KUSURI Roccal Wound Cleaner on and around the wound site. Leave for 10-15 seconds. Using a fresh cotton bud dry the wound site.
    Sterilising the wound:
    Using a fresh cotton bud apply KUSURI Anti-Bac to the wound. Pay careful attention to work the solution around any damaged scales, avoiding disturbance to the good scales. Allow to dry and using a clean cotton bud apply a second application. Before this dries move quickly to the next stage.
    Dressing the wound:
    While still wet, carefully sprinkle, KUSURI Oraheasive Powder on to the wound site. Gently blow off any excess powder. Using the filled spray bottle (tap water), lightly mist the wound site and apply a second coating of Oraheasive Powder, again gently blowing off any excess powder.
    This process will form a clear skin like coating over the wound site.
    With gloved hand, spray a finger with the tap water, and gently smooth over the skin forming to leave a neat finish.
    Sealing the dressing:
    Carefully blow over the area so it semi dries before using a clean cotton bud to apply KUSURI Top Coat Sealer to the formed skin area. Blow gently to evaporate and dry the area.
    Returning the fish to the pond:
    Once all areas to be treated have been completed, return the fish to the pond by gently supporting from underneath. Hold the fish in to the flow of an air stone until she recovers. If the fish is large enough, place a finger in to her mouth and stroke the roof area to encourage the fish to swallow and gulp. This allows the highly oxygenated water to pass over the gills, speeding up the recovery.
    Note:
    If a fish sedates quickly, it is usual that the fish recovers out of sedation quickly. If the fish takes longer to sedate it will usually take longer to recover out of sedation too.
    This treatment can be repeated after 3-4 days if healing is not occurring, still red. Observing the Koi is critical in deciding whether further treatment is required. Within 3-4 days depending on water temperature you should see signs of the wound site turning from red (infected) to pink (new skin tissue generation occurring) to white (healed wound). It is always a difficult decision whether to net and bowl the fish for observation after a few days as this procedure can damage the fish, undoing the healing process that has occurred. If the wound site is under the fish and difficult to observe, leave it for 7 days before re-examining the Koi in a bowl or a polythene bag.
    Disclaimer:
    KUSURI 8 Piece Topical Treatment Kit is to be used at the owners discretion. Kusuri Products Limited will not hold themselves responsible for any misuse. Depending on the health and strength of the fish being treated, fish loses during this process can happen. Kusuri Products Limited will not be held responsible if this occurs.
    Replacement kit components are available at: Kusuri Koi Carp, Aquarium and Pond Products or your local Kusuri Retailer.
    You can also print the instructions here
    look on ebay or elsewhere they used to be £42.00

    hope that helps mate.
    fred
    Thank you, will order one

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  18. #11
    Senior Member Rank = Gosai SamuraiJack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anne View Post
    Wishing your sister a Speedy recovery Mo......
    Thank you Anne

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  20. #12
    Senior Member Rank = Gosai SamuraiJack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frimley Koi keeper View Post
    Sorry to hear that Mo, hope she recovers fully and quickly. And hope you get your pond issues sorted too.

    Good luck
    Thank you, it's all happening, stressed out totally

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  22. #13
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Supreme Champion Frimley Koi keeper's Avatar
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    Try not to let it get you down Mo

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  24. #14
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion freddyboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SamuraiJack View Post
    Thank you, it's all happening, stressed out totally
    Keep your chin up mate. Fingers crossed for you. Your sister will need you to be strong for her. And where here to try and help with your pond and fish mate.
    Fred

    Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

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