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  1. #1
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Adult Champion go54nke's Avatar
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    Water hardness etc..

    Some info that I had saved from some time ago...
    Posted with kind permission from Mike Snaden Yume Koi - Suppliers Of High Quality Nishikigoi

    Some of the following is fact, and some of it is my own theory (as far as my calculations at the bottom are concerned). Make of it, what you will...

    Water Hardness, Carbonate Hardness, Alkalinity, and TDS.

    Following recent debate, I have decided to encapsulate all of the above parameters into an article that will help clear up what each parameter is
    made up of, and it's function.

    GH (General Hardness) is generally accepted as being a measure of Ca++ (Calcium) and Mg++ (Magnesium) ions present in a water sample.


    Carbonate Hardness is the level of Carbonate and Bicarbonate buffers in a water sample.

    Alkalinity is the quantity of all acid neutralising ions present in water.

    TDS, is effectively conductivity, or if you like, Total Dissolved Solids.

    GH and KH explained (please note that 17.86 mg/l is used below, as this equates to 1dH)
    General Hardness although purely a measure of Ca++ and Mg++ ions, is actually measured as 'GH as CaCO3'. This makes no reference to whether
    Carbonate Hardness is present or not, but as a figure of how much CaCO3 would be present is these ions were part of Calcium Carbonate. So, remember, if it is referred to as 17.86mg/l CaCO3, this means it would be 17.86 mg/l. IF it were part of CaCO3. The reason for this is simple… In a normal pond pH, the Carbonate level will exist primarily as Bicarbonates (HCO3). As the pH approaches 10.25, the Carbonate level will exist predominantly as Carbonates (CO3). In a lower pH, the Carbonate ions each form Bicarbonate ions.
    Since hard water is a result of water often permeating through limestone, much CaCO3 (Calcium Carbonate) will become become dissolved into the water.
    When this happens, for each 17.86mg/l that becomes dissolved into the water, there will be 7.143mg of Ca present, and 10.714mg of Carbonate ions. So,
    even though the quantities of each of these components are different, the Ca ions will be measured as “17.86mg/l as CaCO3” (1dGH), and the Carbonate ions will be measured as “17.86mg/l as CaCO3” (1dKH). The reason for this is that the ions on their own are hard to quantify, because if the Carbonate hardness is present as Bicarbonates (as they are in a lower pH), each Carbonate ion will take on a hydrogen ion to form Bicarbonate ions, which will become 21.8mg/l in 17.86mg/l. But, due to the differing atomic weights, the heavier Bicarbonate level would still be measured as “17.86mg/l as CaCO3” (1dKH). Bear in mind that in order to become Bicarbonate, hydrogen ions have been taken on board, making it's atomic mass heavier.
    A GH reading where CaCO3 is predominant, will generally have an equal level of KH and GH when expressed as “mg/l as CaCO3” despite the actual weights
    being multiples of 7.143mg/l Calcium per 1 dGH, and 10.714mg/l Carbonate per 1dKH being present. But, water makeup is very complex, with many other mineral ions, non-mineral ions and sulphates, oxides, and so on, being present. Just because a water sample has a GH of 5dH, it does not necessarily mean that the KH will also be 5dH. A water sample can have a higher GH than KH (if caused by Magnesium Sulphate MgSO4 for example). It is also possible to have a higher level of KH than GH, since the carbonates can also be attached to other anions, such as Sodium (as Sodium Bicarbonate). Although the Carbonates in this case are attached to a Sodium anion, they would still be measured as “mg/l as CaCO3” as a measurement needs to be quantified so that it can be easily understood, or converted into the German 'dH' scale.
    So just to clear confusion… GH DOES NOT CONTAIN KH! It is simply the 'measured as CaCO3' title that is common between the parameters. Consider this as meaning “IF it were part of CaCO3” It doesn't mean that CO3 ions are present in the sample, nor does it mean they aren't… the test is indiscriminate, as it only testing for Ca++ and Mg++ ions.

    Alkalinity is the measure of ALL ions present that will mop up Hydrogen ions in the process of stopping the water from becoming acidic. Carbonate hardness forms the greater part of Alkalinity, with other negative ions such as hydroxide, silicates, borates, and phosphates, etc, that are present. It is primarily the Bicarbonates that buffer the pH from falling. The Carbonates are kind of like a Bicarbonate reserve, if you like. But, Carbonate hardness, forms part of the bigger 'Alkalinity'.


    Test kits…
    A GH test kit will only measure the positive ions (Cations) of Ca and Mg. Other mineral ions contributing to permanent hardness aren't measured. A GH test
    kit will not give a reading that has any bearing or indication of what a KH level might be, so beware!

    A KH test kit measures the amount of all ions present that can mop up Hydrogen ions, and stop the water from becoming acidic. These are predominantly the
    Carbonates and Bicarbonates.

    TDS stands for Total Dissolved Solids. Basically, this unit puts a charge through the water, and measures the conductivity of the water. In short, the
    higher the concentration of ions of any kind present, the higher the TDS. Suspended particles don't measure, so dirty water, may NOT necessarily be high
    TDS water! Even CO2, and Oxygen will show up on a TDS meter! It measures all and sundry that is in the water that is present in ion form (dissolved).

    Total Hardness… this term means different things to different people. People in aquatics circles tend to think that the sum of General Hardness (GH) and
    Carbonate Hardness (KH) can be added together and called 'Total Hardness'. People ion analysis tend to think of Total Hardness being the sum of mineral
    ions such as Calcium, Magnesium, Selenium, Barium, and so on. Others laboratory people regard General Hardness as 'AKA Total Hardness', and to be simply the sum of Ca++ and Mg++ ions.
    Total Hardness makes me cringe, as it is simply something that can't be accurately quantified! I will explain what I mean…
    In my mains water at the time of writing, my mains water has a GH (Ca++ and Mg++) reading of 250ppm, which would be measured as '250 mg/l IF it were all in the form of CaCO3' (14dH). In my case (Limestone area), most of these Ca++ ions probably did originally come from CaCO3. My KH is 178.6mg/l (10dH) 'If it were in the form of CaCO3'. Now, strictly speaking the KH test is not entirely measuring Carbonate ions, as other alkaline ions can also be present, albeit in very small numbers. But, as you can see from the GH of 14, and KH of 10, IF (and only if) all of the Carbonate ions originally came from CaCO3, then there is a GH level of 4 that isn't associated with CaCO3, possible CaO, or so on?...
    The TDS of this sample is 282ppm (mg/l), so as you see, adding the GH and KH readings (250ppm + 178.6ppm), the total theoretical figure as CaCO3, is in fact 428.6ppm (mg/l). As you can see, the sum of these figures is higher than the ACTUAL TDS, so things should start to make sense now. Bear in mind, that other ions (from Chlorine, Chloramine, Oxygen, Carbon Dioxide, and many others) are also present in the TDS reading, the actual Total combined figure from the GH and KH ions isn't feasible. Here's why… Assuming all GH ions were Ca++, (calculated from atomic weight) these would have amounted to 100mg/l (ppm)
    as purely Ca++ ions, but would have been represented as “IF from CaCO3” in the GH test. Now, if we take the KH reading and make an assumption that it were entirely in the form of Carbonate ions, this would equate to 107.14mg/l (ppm). The sum of Ca++ ions in this case would total 207.14mg/l (ppm). But, can this be regarded as an accurate quantity?... NO! Why?... in my waters pH the larger part of the Carbonate ions would be present as Bicarbonate ions. So, assuming it were ALL (just assuming!), then there would be 218mg/l (ppm) of purely Bicarbonate ions. If we look at the total of Ca++ by weight (100mg/l) and add these to the Bicarbonate reading of 218mg/l, we get a grand total of 318mg/l (ppm), which is higher than the TDS of 282, so we can safely assume that all of the Carbonate ions ARE NOT present as Bicarbonate in this case. So, if we jump to an assumption that the Bicarbonate and Carbonate ions are present in equal levels, (107.14+218X0.5), we have an average of 162.7mg/l (ppm). If we then added this total to the assumed Ca++ of 100mg/l, we would have a theoretical TDS of 262.7ppm… allowing for other ions, other than Calcium, orCarbonates/Bicarbonates, then this is more like it!
    But… one problem!... If all of these Calcium + Carbonate ions came purely and solely from CaCO3, and with ALL of the Carbonate ions present as Carbonate (not Bicarbonate) we have a discrepancy! The Ca content by weight from CaCO3, would be 40%, with the content being 60%, if we regarded ALL of the Ca++ ions being linked as CaCO3, with our GH test result being 250mg/l “If as CaCO3”, we would need 150mg/l of Carbonate ions to correctly pair up, but we only have 107.14 available from our KH, so there is a shortfall of 42.86, which would indicate that some of the Calcium ions were paired up perhaps as CaO? Looking at it the other way around, if all of the Carbonate ions were linked as CaCO3 (KH being 178.6mg/l), we would need 71.44mg/l if we add this figure to our available Carbonate ions, we get a total 171.44mg/l of CaCO3, meaning that there are 7.16mg/l of Calcium that must be linked to something else, like CaO?

    cont....



  2. #2
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Adult Champion go54nke's Avatar
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    The above figures are purely theoretical, and can't be quantified. They are purely to help understand the “If as CaCO3” reading that is used for our GH
    and KH test results, and that you can't simply add them together and come up with a total, when it has already been assumed (for test methods) that they are linked as CaCO3 anyway (ie, we can't count them twice!) If we want to work out how to add Ca++ ions and CO3 ions together and call it “Total Hardness” we first have to disassociate the ions from the ones they are 'assumed' to have been paired with originally. Since we don't know how much of our Carbonate hardness is in the form of Carbonate ions, or Bicarbonate ions, we have no accurate way off adding them together and quantifying them!

    If we were to look at GH as all being in the form of CaCO3, then we could perhaps call the GH 'Total Hardness'. But, remember, in a pond, we are
    continuously using up our KH level, and have a GH that it continually rising (if water is never changed), so it is plain to see that in this instance we
    can't say that the GH exists “As if from CaCO3” because it simply isn't! All we know from this, is that the GH test, is counting Ca++ and Mg++ ions.
    In the case of the KH test, we are measuring predominantly CO3- ions. But, we can't say that these are or were hooked up as CaCO3, or not. They could
    have all come from Sodium Bicarbonte!

    .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ......


    Following a recent debate elsewhere on this topic, I have decided to post this here in the hope of clearing some confusion, and want to be marked on it by the great critic, for my work so far! So Dunc, does it make sense to you? I know that it is a bit messy, but it isn't finished yet!

    Water Hardness, Carbonate Hardness, Alkalinity, and TDS.

    Following recent debate, I have decided to encapsulate all of the above parameters into an article that will help clear up what each parameter is made up of, and it's function.

    GH (General Hardness) is generally accepted as being a measure of Ca++ (Calcium) and Mg++ (Magnesium) ions present in a water sample.

    Carbonate Hardness is the level of Carbonate and Bicarbonate buffers in a water sample.

    Alkalinity is the quantity of all acid neutralising ions present in water.

    TDS, is effectively conductivity, or if you like, Total Dissolved Solids.

    GH and KH explained (please note that 17.86 mg/l is used below, as this equates to 1dH)
    General Hardness although purely a measure of Ca++ and Mg++ ions, is actually measured as 'GH as CaCO3'. This makes no reference to whether Carbonate Hardness is present or not, but as a figure of how much CaCO3 would be present is these ions were part of Calcium Carbonate. So, remember, if it is referred to as 17.86mg/l CaCO3, this means it would be 17.86 mg/l. IF it were part of CaCO3. The reason for this is simple… In a normal pond pH, the Carbonate level will exist primarily as Bicarbonates (HCO3). As the pH approaches 10.25, the Carbonate level will exist predominantly as Carbonates (CO3). In a lower pH, the Carbonate ions take on a Hydrogen ions, to become Bicarbonate ions.
    Since hard water is a result of water often permeating through limestone, much CaCO3 (Calcium Carbonate) will become become dissolved into the water.
    When this happens, for each 17.86mg/l that becomes dissolved into the water, there will be 7.143mg of Ca present, and 10.714mg of Carbonate ions. So, even though the quantities of each of these components are different, the Ca ions will be measured as “17.86mg/l as CaCO3” (1dGH), and the Carbonate ions will be measured as “17.86mg/l as CaCO3” (1dKH). The reason for this is that the ions on their own are hard to quantify, because if the Carbonate hardness is present as Bicarbonates (as they are in a lower pH), each Carbonate ion will break to form two Bicarbonate ions, which will become 21.8mg/l in 17.86mg/l. But, due to the differing atomic weights, the heavier Bicarbonate level would still be measured as “17.86mg/l as CaCO3” (1dKH).
    A GH reading where CaCO3 is predominant, will generally have an equal level of KH and GH when expressed as “mg/l as CaCO3” despite the actual weights being multiples of 7.143mg/l Calcium per 1 dGH, and 10.714mg/l Carbonate per 1dKH being present. But, water makeup is very complex, with many other mineral ions, non-mineral ions and sulphates, oxides, and so on, being present. Just because a water sample has a GH of 5dH, it does not necessarily mean that the KH will also be 5dH. A water sample can have a higher GH than KH (if caused by Magnesium Sulphate MgSO4 for example). It is also possible to have a higher level of KH than GH, since the carbonates can also be attached to other anions, such as Sodium (as Sodium Bicarbonate). Although the Carbonates in this case are attached to a Sodium anion, they would still be measured as “mg/l as CaCO3” as a measurement needs to be quantified so that it can be easily understood, or converted into the German 'dH' scale.
    So just to clear confusion… GH DOES NOT CONTAIN KH! It is simply the 'measured as CaCO3' title that is common between the parameters. Consider this as meaning “IF it were part of CaCO3”
    It is primarily the Bicarbonates that buffer the pH from falling. The Carbonates are kind of like a Bicarbonate reserve, if you like. But, Carbonate
    hardness, forms part of the bigger 'Alkalinity'.

    Alkalinity is the measure of ALL ions present that will mop up Hydrogen ions in the process of stopping the water from becoming acidic. Carbonate hardness forms the greater part of Alkalinity, with other negative ions such as hydroxide, silicates, borates, and phosphates, etc, that are present.

    Test kits…
    A GH test kit will only measure the positive ions (Cations) of Ca and Mg. Other mineral ions contributing to permanent hardness aren't measured. A GH test kit will not give a reading that has any bearing or indication of what a KH level might be, so beware!

    A KH test kit measures the amount of all ions present that can mop up Hydrogen ions, and stop the water from becoming acidic. These are predominantly the Carbonates and Bicarbonates.

    TDS stands for Total Dissolved Solids. Basically, this unit puts a charge through the water, and measures the conductivity of the water. In short, the
    higher the concentration of ions of any kind present, the higher the TDS. Suspended particles don't measure, so dirty water, may NOT necessarily be high TDS water! Even CO2, and Oxygen will show up on a TDS meter! It measures all and sundry that is in the water that is present in ion form (dissolved).
    .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. .....

    Anyway... I am not sure what ***** is talking about, as s***** keeps talking about hardness, and the amount of oyster shells breeders use? Shells don't buffer hardness, they simply dissolve on demand if water is producing large numbers of hydrogen ions (acid). Excessive use of shells will buffer KH to a degree, but a high KH doesn't mean that the water is 'hard'. Anyhow, all of the water that ***** tested was in breeders premises... places used only for 'holding' Koi, not growing them! The high stocking densities of holding ponds, means that many hydrogen ions are being produced, and hence, KH buffering is needed.
    But, mud ponds are a different matter entirely!

    Anyone remember this pic from last Summer? The meter is showing the TDS level of one of Momotaro's best performing mountain mud ponds. The TDS
    reading of 36ppm represents the combination of KH, GH, and organics in the pond, and yet the pond is brown! The brown colour is just stirred up mud, which isn't dissolved (but suspended), and hence, doesn't show up in the TDS reading.

    What I have been harping on about in all my articles, is making efforts to 'safely' try to emulate 'near' mud pond water, in an attempt to get mud pond results, NOT to emulate a breeders holding ponds!!!

    Another point, whilst on a roll... I think that RO plants can be very usefull for people in hard water areas, but I have NEVER EVER encouraged anyone to use only RO water. Untreated mains water MUST be mixed back in, to make a mix of water that is safe for keeping Koi.

    It is argued that soft water effects Sumi development. I feel that this is only partly true. I think that soft water will to a degree slow down Sumi
    development, but if hard water is necessary in order to make sumi show on a particular Koi, then the chances are that the sumi is very low quality anyway.
    Good Sumi will show regardless, in time. Temperature is a good tool for controlling Sumi development.
    .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ......

    cont....

    If your pond and mains water both have a KH of 3, why would you need to raise it? From these readings alone, it is obvious tht your pond is either low
    stocked, little fed, extrememely well maintained, or all three. So, were you given one good reason for raising it to 5.5???

    KH is there for the purpose of keeping the pH buffered. There is absolutely no benefit to raising it higher that necessary to achieve this. Some poeple
    have said that the filter needs KH... which is rubbish. The biomass don't feed on KH, but simply produce acids that try to lower the PH, which are then neutralised by the KH. The Koi don't use KH either. Sure, they need a little calcium, but this wouldn't be obtained from the KH anyway.

    All the best,

    Mike.

  3. #3
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Adult Champion go54nke's Avatar
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    Give me one good reason why you raise the GH up to a level of 10? Is it because a dealer has convinced you that you should, and conveniently has some on the shelf to sell you?
    I have often heard it said that Koi benefit from KH and GH in the water. But, there is a big differance between 'enough', and excess. Fish don't use KH,
    and KH is only burnt up when Hydrogen ions are produced by the filter, or decaying waste starts to try to turn the water acidic.
    I believe that the Koi have a natural blood level of 8 mg/l of calcium in the blood, and that calcium is absorbed passively. Koi can get all the calcium
    they need from their food, so why should there be any need for adding more to the water?
    In 1998, I got hooked up with a Japanese ZNA judge, who got me onto the TDS and GH/KH route. In 1999 he sent me a TDS meter from Japan. I then spent until July 2002 trying to get my TDS levels as low as possible (using hard mains water). This improved things a little, but apart from a few Koi that showed 'freak' growth, I was still pretty disappointed with Koi keeping. In July 2002, I got my RO plant. The remainder of 2002 was the first time that I ever got consistently good growth.
    A customer of mine in Bridgend (Wales) has bought some expensive Koi from me over the past few years, including one of the first Momotaro Koi that I imported on my first trip to Momotaro in 2001. He used to get really good results with his Koi. Then, a dealer convinced him in 2002 that he should raise his GH and KH levels. Doing this caused him blanket weed problems for the first time ever, and also shimis on his Koi. Growth also slowed down. Things only just started getting back on track in the later part of last year, as it took him that long to reduce his KH and GH back to where it used to be.
    Another customer in Bath has two ponds. He was always of the opinion that there must be a reason why he couldn't get the same results as Japanese breeders, and could not get much sense out of the breeders on his trips to Japan. Then, in Spring of last year, he bought a 'Kent' RO plant, and put it onto one of his ponds, whilst using his TDS meter to try and run TDS levels as low as he could on his other pond (using hard water). Both ponds were heated to the same temperature, and the Koi were fed the same feeding regime. He phoned me up last Summer to tell me that he was 'absolutely convinced' about soft water for Koi, and then started to use RO water for his other pond as well. He said that only the Koi in the RO pond showed significant growth. Only one or two Koi grew in the 'hard water' pond.
    Also, in January of last year, Cliff Neale went the same route, and is also absolutely convinced about soft water for Koi. Last year was THE FIRST TIME
    that Cliff ever had any success with growing Koi. He could grow small Koi at a reasonable rate, but could never grow any older Koi. Even his Sanke
    (85cm at last years National), has now grown to over 90cm! Koi that never grew in prior years, started to grow last year.
    Numerous people have gone down the 'TDS Road' last year, and every single one of them is over the moon with the results. But, those that haven't tried it, are quite rightly dubious.
    In Japan, the water is soft wherever you go. Koi keepers will refer to water with a TDS of perhaps just 120ppm, and feel that it is too hard. Momotaro
    generally has a TDS of between 70 and 80ppm on their indoor growing ponds, with mudponds running with a TDS of below 40ppm. I have Mr Maeda (Momotaro) on video tape from April 2002, telling Brian Sousa, and myself that soft water is very important for growing 'Jumbo Koi'.
    Below are a few snippets of text from notes I have compiled over the last few years, so forgive me if topics change unexpectedly...
    ________________________________
    Most of England has hard water. Hard water is water that is high in content of calcium and magnesium salts. Clay is predominantly calcium, and shouldn't really be called clay, as it is more of a stone powder. Refresh rock is rock, not clay water all over Japan is incredibly soft. Japan's hardest water is softer than most of England's softest water. The calcium in water does has some effect on the skins appearance (short term), but not the Kois bone structure. Good Koi food is the only worthwhile way to build bone structure.
    Soft water is the ultimate way to grow Koi fast. I had a long discussion with staff of Momotaro Koi Farm last week, and they were completely in agreement that soft water was needed to grow Koi big. Mr Nobuo Takigawa says that hardness should be ideally below 50ppm (about 2.7dH). Mr Izeki of Izeki products says that if hardness is above 2dH, it should be lowered. Clays will raise water hardness, and I wouldn't mind betting that 90% of posters on the BB have higher water hardness levels than those stated above. I find this whole subject frustrating, as many people concentrate on making Koi look finished, but this slows the growth immensely. People over here always seem to wonder why Koi can't be grown big in this country. But, if we all payed more attention to Japanese techniques instead of British technology (money spinners), then we could all grow Koi fast enough and big enough to learn at perhaps 3 times the speed that we do.
    If anyone thinks that clays are neccesary, I will challenge you to come here and visit! I am doing my utmost to remove calcium from my water, and the
    results are astounding...try me!?
    Sure, Japanese use it over winter, but bear this in mind... 1) Japanese water is dead, devoid of minerals (calcium). 2) changing water in winter means
    chilling water greatly, so clays will replenish the water during winter.
    Please see the attached pic. This Kohaku was born on the 17th of May 2001. Last year, as Tosai, it measured 31cm (in June). It now resides in Swansea,
    where GH levels and KH levels in the mains water both measure 2dh. The pond water KH runs at 1dh, pH is 7.0, Gh in pond is about 1dH, and TDS
    (Total Dissolved Solids) runs at 80ppm. No clay has ever been added to this pond. In fact, no additives at all have ever been thrown in! Does this Koi
    look either weak in bones, or skin? It now measures 54cm, is male, and nearly two years old. All we need is to be patient. Sorry to get 'on one', but
    people should try and grow Koi, not ruin them by finishing them.
    Momotaro... Fresh water TDS 73ppm, ponds in general run a TDS of about 80ppm on average. But, the best performing Tosai growing pond runs at a TDS of 53ppm, a KH of 1dH, and by my estimation, a GH that can't feasibly be higher than 1dH.
    Buy an R/O plant, but be sure to mix the water with mains water when doing top ups. It's really easy to do. In my case, I use the TDS meter. Here is an example...
    Mains water TDS is currently 335ppm KH level is 11.
    R/O plant gives water TDS of zero, and KH of Zero (pure H2O).
    Mix the two at a ratio of 75% R/O water, and 25% water and the result is a TDS of 84, and a KH of 2.75dH...perfect! So, get the water mixing, and check the TDS. If it is higher than 84, turn the mains water down a little. If the reading is low, turn it up.
    If your pond is over stocked, overfed, under-maintained, spasmodically maintained, or not regularly water checked...forget it!!!
    You mention hard and soft water, and yet you quote pH levels? It is not uncommon to have soft KH, and still have a high pH, and vice versa. Hard water can be put into a pond, and can be depleted of KH and still be left with high GH (hard water).
    In short, I can't give any advice on how to lower pH with an R/O plant. GH, KH, and anything else dissolved in water, will cause a high TDS. The need
    for the R/O plant is primarily 'dilute' these overall levels and obtain a low TDS. "Money for old rope"... Lets look at the other end of the scale. You have soft water, which also has a KH level of 1dH, and hence, have trouble keeping your pH level safe. You visit your local dealer, and he tell you that your KH is too low, and you need to maintain it at 10dh. As luck would have it, he has endless supplies of Bicarb on the shelf to sell you. Now, lets assume that that your pond water KH is zero, and it takes 100 kgs of Bicarb to get your KH up to 10, so that's what you throw in. Each 10kg bag of Bicarb costs £10, so you just shelled out £100. Well, each day, you change 10% of water, which takes your KH down to 9dh, and hence every day you throw in 10kgs of Bicarb. In this situation, you are spending £70 per week on Bicarb!
    cont....

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  5. #4
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Adult Champion go54nke's Avatar
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    cont...
    So, lets assume that you are in the same position, but you are advised to maintain a KH of 4dH. A 10% water change will drop your water to perhaps a KH level of 3.6dh. Well, now you only have to add 4kgs to get back on track... only £28 per week!
    "Reality"... Why have a high KH? Even in a reasonably heavily stocked pond, as KH level of 3dH is almost impossible to deplete in a week. So, what do
    you do?... Do you buy a KH test kit and watch it? Or do you throw in loads of Bicarb to shoot the KH through the roof? Chances are that if you carry on with regular water changes, your KH will always be 3dH.... the result?... no expense wasted on Bicarb!
    In a pond with a KH of just 1dH, the pH will probably never drop below 7. But at a KH of 2dH the pH will probably always run at 7.5, but in a KH of 4 or 5dH, the pH will be the same. Push the KH higher, and the pH will have a tendancy to run higher...perhaps up to 8.3? Why bother? The Japanese generally feel that a pH nearer to 7 is ideal anyway.
    Colin's water in Swansea has a KH level similar to Devon, running at 2dH from the tap. This is just fine as long as maintenance is good. Colin keeps water trickling in, which in turn keeps everything stable with a KH of 1. The downside is that if he lets his KH drop even a little, the pH will start
    falling. It only takes a few days of lack of maintenance to let the KH fall, but weeks to get it back again, bearing in mind that his mains water only has a KH of 2dH.
    Now, if Colin were to overstock, he would never keep a safe KH and pH, and would have to resort to either Bicarb, or a constant top up from the nearest fire hydrant!
    I don't feel that soft water is the 'answer'. But, I do feel that hard water, or more importantly, high TDS water is the growth limiting factor.
    My TDS meter is a Japanese one, and is called a "Water quality instrument". Basically, TDS measures anything dissolved into the water. In short,
    get a TDS reading on your pond, and compare it to mains water. Do the same with KH and GH. The difference in relationships between TDS and the KH and GH give an indication of the levels of dissolved fish waste...or "Water quality".
    "Growth"... My combination for growth is as follows...
    Soft water with low TDS, temperature of perhaps 23 or 24c, many small feeds from an autofeeder,
    Loads of aeration, Nitrates, a pond with a good filtration system that doesn't create bad bacteria, Good pond depth, good circulation to keep the Koi active.
    Most of the above will have an effect like credit scoring. Each will give a percentage of benefit to increased growth and condition. But, with hard water, the other factors become far less effective.
    My R/O plant consumes 750 watts of power. The electricity board loves me, as I singlehandedly pay their wages! My 4400 gallon Tosai pond has about 110 Koi in it. It is only 4ft 6inches deep, and has very little pumped circulation. But, it has soft water, loads of small feeds, 24c temp, and loads of aeration... growth is now astounding!
    Mr Maeda of Momotaro said this to one of my customers last week... "Buy an expensive Tosai from him and leave it there to grow, and it can become a cheap Koi. Buy an expensive Koi and take it back to England, and it becomes an expensive Koi!" Why?... Buy a 50cm Tosai for perhaps £2000, and it will become a perhaps a 65cm Nisai, and perhaps 72cm Sansai? At this point in time, it could be worth 10 times it's original price. But, take it back to England and ruin it, and it's worth nothing.
    When Daisuke Maeda came to England in March, I took him to Colin's pond in Swansea. Of the Tosai that Colin bought last year, Daisuke reckoned that two of them would grow past 85cm easily! He was amazed at the growth and quality. Last year, these Koi cost £195 and £350. Daisuke also said that one of these Koi would command a price of 1 million yen if were at their Farm as it is now. Now, that's become a cheap Koi!
    This whole thing in respect to soft/hard, TDS etc all swings more importantly around the TDS level. You can have water with low GH and KH levels, but it is possible to have a high TDS due to lack of maintenance. But, KH and GH levels in mains water are the factors that limit the possibility of lowering TDS.
    A TDS meter from Kusuri will cost you about £30. Why not get one and start experimenting?
    You may be scepticle about this whole topic, and I don't blame you. But, in Japan, if you can get your point across when asking the question, they will well understand this topic.
    I am not saying that low TDS levels will make your Koi grow. What I am saying is that high TDS levels will slow the growth. Some people say that Koi grow to the size of the pond, or that female Koi put out hormones that stop Koi growing... what is the case here, is that over time, the TDS has risen.
    It is possible to maintain water in a pond in such a way that Koi will grow far to big for it. People over here say that they have good growth, but in truth, it can often happen that one or two Koi can have freak growth in relation to others in the pond. This good growth may be perhaps 5cm a year. But, with the whole TDS thing, coupled with good feeding and all the other points I mentioned in the previous thread, you can make Koi grow like they do in Japan... I promise you!
    You may laugh, but Colin in Swansea (and a few others that are now making their water soft) will grow Koi from Tosai to 80cm plus within the next five years! Hey, if anyone wants to, I can arrange a pond visit to Swansea!???
    Also, I have a customer in Bath. I hadn't seen this gentleman since last Summer. He came here a month ago and announced that last Summer, he had bought an R/O plant. The intersting thing is, he has two ponds. Both are heated and maintained in the same manner. The ponds have been run in the same manner with the exception of one factor... the R/O plant has been used on only one of the ponds! When he came here, here said that he had noted the following observations...
    1) The Koi in the R/O pond became more energetic.
    2) they started to grow noticeably within about a month.
    He also said that he has now been running the system for about 8 months, and the Koi in the R/O pond have grown significantly, whereas the Koi in the other pond don't appear to have grown at all. His final words were, "I am absolutely convinced!"
    He had tried finding out in Japan about it, but the comprehension was lost through the interpretation....a case of "Wakaranai!"
    I have Mr Maeda on my video from April 2002 saying that you need soft water in order to grow Jumbo Koi.
    I know you won't be convinced, as this whole topic completely cuts against everything that we have been led to believe. But, just give it a try. I have spent the last four and a half years researching this, and was put onto this thing by a Japanese ZNA Koi Judge. The following are excerpts from some emails from him...
    _____________________
    Koi grows well when water hardness is low. Water hardness is 90ppm from 35ppm. Usually, it is 200ppm in the garden pond from 180ppm. Growth rate is low at this time. male Kohaku.
    This Koi grew only 4cm because it was being put in the garden pond of 150ppm from water hardness 110ppm. This is thought growth rate to be bad. Usually, more than 7cm will grow when it is put in the field pond.
    Investigate the pond water of the Koi maniacs of U.K by this TDS meter. Data are very interesting by accumulating.
    Water hardness will rise with the pond water which gave it food. It is desirable to measure fresh water and pond water. Please, let's raise Koi knowledge by this TDS meter. Let me know it after measuring water hardness of your pond water and the fresh water (water service water).
    I will do advice to you about water hardness. You should judge the water quality by total hardness. Water hardness data. My water service water is 75ppm. Well water is 108ppm. Deep well water is 154ppm. Rainwater is 3ppm.
    About the change of water hardness.
    When food is given to it, water hardness rises with the pond water. You should understand this thing. Then, you should lower total hardness of your pond water.
    Koi libertines in the UK aren't thought to be understood about the water quality. You should investigate yourself about total hardness of the water.
    Koi doesn't eat food in the high water temperature in the case of high water hardness. However, Koi is coming to eat because it is a fish to apply to the environment. It often occurs in the Koi from Japan that food isn't eaten.
    At this time, Koi only swims through the bottom of the pond.
    Then, it is the primary cause that HI gets bad. It is the primary cause that it is said that Koi gets wrong about the water of the UK. It is the primary
    cause that as for this, total hardness of the water of is very high. The water of the field pond is rainwater. It is necessary to use rainwater in the UK.
    But, you must not put it in the pond directly.
    Collect thing gives OK to the big water tank. Then, it is desirable to expose it to the sun.

    cont...

  6. #5
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Adult Champion go54nke's Avatar
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    cont...
    After air is put, collected rainwater gives OK to keeping it for three days. Then, it is desirable to put rainwater in the pond.
    HI gets bad when water hardness is high. Growth rate lowers as for the Koi when water hardness rises. Even if many foods are given to it, water hardness doesn't rise in the field pond. The water quality of the field pond has the ability which resolves mineral by the microorganism.
    How to lower water hardness. Spend the thing which ion is exchanged for. For example, ion exchange resin. Zeolite etc.
    However, effect won't appear because it is the big volume of water. Koi eats many foods.
    It is this cause that your Koi (Hirasawa Kohaku) is thin.
    It is desirable that water hardness is low in both summer and winter.
    This advantage.
    Water hardness gives OK to being low to maintain HI color.
    Salt makes HI color decline a little.
    However, as for the salt, white ground improves.
    The food which increases pigment cells is necessary so that HI may be raised. Spirulina gives OK to being used. However, because white ground is made to decline, it is necessary for the Spirulina to give it to it carefully.
    About water hardness.
    Iron, salt and calcium raise water hardness.
    Then, food will raise water hardness. Ammonia raises water hardness, too.
    _______________________
    The above are extracts from numerous emails, but I think you'll get the drift. "Water hardness" in these excerpts really refers to
    Total Hardness... or TDS.
    At the end of the day, water hardness is hard to comprehend, as we can't see a differance in the water with our eyes. We also can't see car exhaust fumes, but we can choke on them. I have one motive and dream with the whole water thing. My sole intention is to try to make people get more out of the hobby. If people get more out of Koi, they will quickly learn whos Koi are good, and whose are bad. Then, hopefully, the whole Koi industry will be forced up-market. Unless this happens, we will never get the results that Japan, Taiwan, Hong Kong, Singapore, Malayasia, etc, achieve, or the keeping skills.
    One other interesting point is the health aspect of soft water. In hard water, if a Koi gets scraped, it more often than not needs treatment to stop it
    going ulcered. But, in soft water, a Koi can do load of damage and heal on its own.
    At Momotaro Koi Farm with Maurice two weeks ago, we were having lunch with Mr Maeda and a couple of Japanese hobbiests, in Momotaro's reception building.
    I knew that Mr Maeda was talking about me, and could understand just a few bits of conversation here and there. Then, he turned and patted me on the back.
    I asked Daisuke what they were talking about, and he said that his Father was talking to them about water, and told them I had a very good understanding of water for Koi. I was very flattered. He then told them I was going to change the way that westerners think about Koi.
    Maybe that's dreaming unrealistically?

    All the best, Mike.

  7. Thanks EME101 Thanked / Liked this Post
  8. #6

    hi

    some very good info thank for shearing

  9. #7
    Intresting read thx

 

 

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