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  1. #141
    Hi all, I'm new to koi keeping and have been reading up on anoxic filtration. I think I understand the chemistry, but now need to know more about the practicalities. So

    1) I've ordered a load of 28x 28x18 baskets ( I hope they are large enough for anoxic to work?)

    2) I now need some advice on the following
    A) what cat litter to use ( What brand has worked recently)
    B) where the heck do you buy laterite? I can only find a few adds on eBay selling 15mm balls of it. How much do I need for 6 x baskets?
    C) what's the cat litter to laterite ratio to use? What thickness of cat litter should separate the water on the outside of the baskets from the laterite within?
    D) I'm thinking of placing unplanted latterite baskets in the deep section of the 1100litre pond feeding the waterfall into the main pond, then placing spacers on top of the baskets and then adding planted laterite baskets on top of the spacers for aesthetics.

    Would that work? Am I missing something really obvious?

  2. #142
    Anyone got any advice for this please?

  3. #143
    Yep, I've written a full explanation of how anoxic filtration works on my website on the link below. It's complete with everything you will need to know in order to build your own and I've tried to address all the questions I've been asked or points that have been raised since my first magazine article on the subject in 2009. Have a read and you should find answers to all your questions:
    Anoxic Filtration

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  5. #144
    Senior Member Rank = Hassai hippo's Avatar
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    I built my anoxic as part of my new build , at around the time this thread kicked off - about 5 years ago . Even back then Laterite was becoming difficult to obtain . I think it has been discontinued for some reason . But you can use an alternative product called JBL aquabasis , which you can buy on amazon - see link below .

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/s?k=jbl+aqu...b_sb_ss_i_2_13

    Just a word on my own experience using anoxic filtration . I ran mine for around 3 years in conjunction with a bead filter . Last year , I had issues with high nitrite . The hot weather meant increased food load , and my filtration didn't cope particularly well . I made the decision to replace my anoxic baskets with k1 media instead . As it was late on in the year , I cant be certain this has improved things , but I`ll be monitoring the situation over the coming months .

    One thing I did notice , was that on removing the baskets , the Aquabasis material had all leaked out , and only the cat litter remained - so I guess it wouldn't function correctly , anyway . My baskets were lined with hession , then filled with cat litter , with the aquabasis in the middle . Something to keep in mind , if you go down this route .

    Having said that , I`m sure there are plenty of people on here who`ve had better experiences than me with anoxic (ref Sid`s post above) , so please don't be put off by my negativity

    Hope all goes well for you
    Colin

    2500 Gallon Fibreglass Pond
    Eazypod , Bio-Max 4 Bead , 18 Basket Anoxic

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  7. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by Manky Sanke View Post
    Yep, I've written a full explanation of how anoxic filtration works on my website on the link below. It's complete with everything you will need to know in order to build your own and I've tried to address all the questions I've been asked or points that have been raised since my first magazine article on the subject in 2009. Have a read and you should find answers to all your questions:
    Anoxic Filtration
    Awesome article, many thanks

  8. #146
    Quote Originally Posted by hippo View Post
    I built my anoxic as part of my new build , at around the time this thread kicked off - about 5 years ago . Even back then Laterite was becoming difficult to obtain . I think it has been discontinued for some reason . But you can use an alternative product called JBL aquabasis , which you can buy on amazon - see link below .

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/s?k=jbl+aqu...b_sb_ss_i_2_13

    Just a word on my own experience using anoxic filtration . I ran mine for around 3 years in conjunction with a bead filter . Last year , I had issues with high nitrite . The hot weather meant increased food load , and my filtration didn't cope particularly well . I made the decision to replace my anoxic baskets with k1 media instead . As it was late on in the year , I cant be certain this has improved things , but I`ll be monitoring the situation over the coming months .

    One thing I did notice , was that on removing the baskets , the Aquabasis material had all leaked out , and only the cat litter remained - so I guess it wouldn't function correctly , anyway . My baskets were lined with hession , then filled with cat litter , with the aquabasis in the middle . Something to keep in mind , if you go down this route .

    Having said that , I`m sure there are plenty of people on here who`ve had better experiences than me with anoxic (ref Sid`s post above) , so please don't be put off by my negativity

    Hope all goes well for you
    Thanks Colin, are you 100% certain that the JBL Aquabasis is comparable to laterite with the same negatively charged structure? Have you/ others used this exact product?

    Also, any idea why cat litter is being suggested and not ordinary gravel? Is it something to do with surface area?

  9. #147
    Senior Member Rank = Hassai hippo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Supra View Post
    Thanks Colin, are you 100% certain that the JBL Aquabasis is comparable to laterite with the same negatively charged structure? Have you/ others used this exact product?

    Also, any idea why cat litter is being suggested and not ordinary gravel? Is it something to do with surface area?
    Yes , I`m pretty sure the JBL was recommended by others on here . Not sure if theres an alternative , as it was a few years ago . Might be worth asking around to see what others used , as I said , it didnt work particularly well for me !

    And yes , I think ordinary gravel would be too coarse for the job . You need the non-clumping type of cat litter - most of the supermarkets and pet stores do it
    Colin

    2500 Gallon Fibreglass Pond
    Eazypod , Bio-Max 4 Bead , 18 Basket Anoxic

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  11. #148
    Senior Member Rank = Hassai hippo's Avatar
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    Just to update - I`ve read Manky`s article , and it does say , you can use JBL Aquabasis instead of laterite .

    Just make sure you check periodically , to see if its still there , and not leaked out , like mine did .
    Colin

    2500 Gallon Fibreglass Pond
    Eazypod , Bio-Max 4 Bead , 18 Basket Anoxic

  12. #149
    How's all the Anoxic filter users finding things these days?

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  14. #150
    Junior Member Rank = Fry Pet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigcarpchaser View Post
    How's all the Anoxic filter users finding things these days?
    Still sweet here. Still no water changes in 5 years, still no parasitic evidence based on fish behaviour.
    Waiting to see Syd's evaluation of this years water tests taken to BKKS show a few weeks ago although I am confident the only thing that will have changed will be GH/KH which was particularly high last year as the sample I took up was a day after the pond had cleared from clay will be lower (GH was around 4 when I tested with earlier)

    Biggest reason I can see as to why people don't enjoy Anoxic success is the fear of walking away from every accepted biological filtration. Fear of taking a blind leap of faith and keeping showers, bead filters, k1 chambers etc running in tandem just-in-case so there's always a vulnerable weak-link waiting to screw things up and keep the water in a constant state of depletion.
    Also diverting from the original design, I have a few baskets that are slightly smaller than advised but they're just space fillers for the excessive amount of correctly sized baskets i have.
    I'll update when Syd's results come back.
    The place that pays the bills.
    https://www.GymRatZ.co.uk


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  16. #151
    Thanks Pete

    Do you run a trickle of some kind or literally have a top up now and again?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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  18. #152
    Junior Member Rank = Fry Pet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigcarpchaser View Post
    Thanks Pete
    Do you run a trickle of some kind or literally have a top up now and again?
    My drum filter is fed direct from mains water supply so there's always a small degree of water addition on every cleaning cycle plus it means naturally balanced/filtered pond water isn't wasted down the drain. Chlorinated water helps keep bio growth from taking hold on the drum screen too and as chlorine/chloramine are UV unstable, in full sun and 30 minute turnover (50% via 72W UV) (13,500 litre pond) chlorine is of no concern.

    99% of the time water level needs siphoning down due to rain as when level raises the gravity skimmer loses it's pull so a home-made "U" shaped siphon made from pushfit plumbing filled and hung over the wall will drop level in a few minutes. If the skimmer stops working due to pond level drop it's always due to a plant that's breached the outer wall and water wicks from pond to garden in which case topping off with the hose is required but it's very rare and only 5 or 10 mm so again neither chlorine nor chloramine are going to be noticed nor measurable.

    On reflection I'd suggest Anoxic + drum are highly efficient water "purifiers" which allow such a tight degree of water recycling whilst allowing the delicate "living" water balance to be maintained dare I say to perfection with nature manageable rainwater dilution and all the bio-diversity of plant and animal life it supports.

    Might be a different story if the drum filter was constantly throwing living pond water down the drain but due to a poor drum design I was forced to see if it would run direct from mains. So many unintentional and experimental variables were included in the pond creation but apart from gravity rather than pumped feed I'd pretty much do everything exactly the same again.
    The place that pays the bills.
    https://www.GymRatZ.co.uk


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  20. #153
    Thanks Pete, my drum is mains fed. I have trickle set up but curious to see if it was actually necessary. Time will tell I suppose.
    Thanks for the comprehensive reply, much appreciated.
    Gary


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  22. #154
    Quote Originally Posted by Pet View Post
    My drum filter is fed direct from mains water supply so there's always a small degree of water addition on every cleaning cycle plus it means naturally balanced/filtered pond water isn't wasted down the drain. Chlorinated water helps keep bio growth from taking hold on the drum screen too and as chlorine/chloramine are UV unstable, in full sun and 30 minute turnover (50% via 72W UV) (13,500 litre pond) chlorine is of no concern.

    99% of the time water level needs siphoning down due to rain as when level raises the gravity skimmer loses it's pull so a home-made "U" shaped siphon made from pushfit plumbing filled and hung over the wall will drop level in a few minutes. If the skimmer stops working due to pond level drop it's always due to a plant that's breached the outer wall and water wicks from pond to garden in which case topping off with the hose is required but it's very rare and only 5 or 10 mm so again neither chlorine nor chloramine are going to be noticed nor measurable.

    On reflection I'd suggest Anoxic + drum are highly efficient water "purifiers" which allow such a tight degree of water recycling whilst allowing the delicate "living" water balance to be maintained dare I say to perfection with nature manageable rainwater dilution and all the bio-diversity of plant and animal life it supports.

    Might be a different story if the drum filter was constantly throwing living pond water down the drain but due to a poor drum design I was forced to see if it would run direct from mains. So many unintentional and experimental variables were included in the pond creation but apart from gravity rather than pumped feed I'd pretty much do everything exactly the same again.
    This sounds like it might be a fix to an issue I have with water levels what a great set up thanks for advice (sorry to hijack post)


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  24. #155
    Junior Member Rank = Fry Pet's Avatar
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    This years 2019 water test results very kindly provided by Syd.

    "Again, as would be expected with an anoxic filtered pond, your nitrate level is very low. There are low levels of ammonia which are probably caused by ordinary nitrifying bacteria which will colonise every wet surface of your pond and have likely responded to the increased feed rate and activity brought about by these temperatures. As last year, the pH is moderately high but the KH is a little low this year. The GH is good for the development of sumi (black) but less good for beni (red). The TDS is a little high but this is chiefly comprised of KH and GH.

    Your phosphate level is still low which is good for the best development of koi skin quality and colour development that the genetics will allow and the trace levels of copper and iron in the water are no threat to the health of your fish.

    The test for total chlorine (free chlorine plus any chloramine) is to verify that whatever method of dechlorination you use is effective. The zero value for total chlorine shows that it is. (See Total Chlorine below).

    Apart from keeping a close watch on the KH value, the only advice I can give is to carry on with whatever regime you are currently adopting;it’s providing good results. "


    Looking good again for my zero maintenance anoxic filter reigieme.
    Thanks again to Syd for water testing and on-going Anoxic wisdom.
    Cheers - Pete
    The place that pays the bills.
    https://www.GymRatZ.co.uk


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  26. #156

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  28. #157
    Senior Member Rank = Sansai Alburglar's Avatar
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    I'm skeptical. Not that it doesn't work, but that a basket full of pea gravel with soil in and a pond plant growing out of it would actually be a better and simpler solution with the plant stripping the ammonia out of the water before it turns to nitrite/nitrate. Plus a Small amount of anoxic filtration occuring in the centre of the baskets.
    I will be making a plant bed in a similar design to what a lot of the anoxic beds look like, with a plant in each basket. Lilies, reeds and other marginals.

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  30. #158
    You should read my article, there isn't any pea gravel and the ammonia reduction isn't due to a plant in soil in a basket. There also isn't a small amount of anoxic reduction in the centre of a basket.

    Comparing vegetable filters with anoxic filtration, the advantage of anoxic is that the bugs that live in anoxic conditions use far more ammonia than plants and they reduce nitrate far more than a plant can.

    This is because the way a plant takes up nitrate requires energy so it can only be done when the plant is making the energy molecule, ATP (adenosine triphosphate) due to photosynthesis whereas ammonia, nitrate, phosphate and DOC in the form of pheromones are drawn into the baskets by electrostatic molecular attraction. This is caused by electrostatically charged sites forming throughout the cat litter so these molecules are presented to the bugs as a "free meal" without them having to expend any energy themselves.
    Anoxic Filtration

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  32. #159
    Iíve nearly finished my Anoxic filter so Iíll post my findings as it happens...or not


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  34. #160
    Senior Member Rank = Sansai Alburglar's Avatar
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    I reckon that there is very little oxygen in the centre of a potted plant pot. That would lend itself to anoxic filtration, perhaps not quite as effectively as the cat litter method. Is it tried and tested that this isn't the case then?

 

 
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