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  1. #41
    Thanks David and Milaz.
    Have you guys been keeping up with Zac’s pump testing thread on Kiophen?
    He seems to have found that the pumps he’s tested only flow about 75% of the stated manufactures claimed figures. Caused quite a stir lol.
    Maybe another thread is required over here for us mortals that’s can’t justify a flowfriend is required that looks at “real world” pump performance.

    Loving your guys information.



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  3. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by bigcarpchaser View Post
    Thanks David and Milaz.
    Have you guys been keeping up with Zac’s pump testing thread on Kiophen?
    He seems to have found that the pumps he’s tested only flow about 75% of the stated manufactures claimed figures. Caused quite a stir lol.
    Maybe another thread is required over here for us mortals that’s can’t justify a flowfriend is required that looks at “real world” pump performance.

    Loving your guys information.



    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Yes - I had read it - very good resource.

    Manky Sanke has on his great website explained why the pumps performance reality is so much different from max specified flow - this is measured at ideal conditions - with only about 1m of pipe with max possible diameter fiitting the pump outflow in straight line so no one in real life will see it - this is why the Total Dynami Head calculator is so important - as well as flow chart for each pump - from which you can see what the real life flow in given setup will be.

    I personally use rule of thumb - that in my pumped setup good pump with max head of min. 5m or more will deliver about 50% of the advertised max flow - and than I look on power consumption as second criteria to decide which one to choose - off course checking also this very valuable forum for real life experience - Feline and others posted very good review of AF DM Vario pumps so it was no brainer to get three of them - very happy with them.

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    You get what you pay for - or better - what you make yourself.

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  5. #43
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Grand Champion lee63's Avatar
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    Very interesting findings there david and milaz, i have found similar with my pumps, i wont go into detail but i always knew they would be no where near what the manufacturer states. What i do know is that most people are in the exact same boat only are totally unaware or way off on their estimations. It makes me cringe when people make a guesstimate without at least trying a simple bucket fill or chamber drop test like yourself.
    The other one that makes me cringe is how many people believe that a pumps head is only from the surface of the pond water Out with the old, in with the new.. The head on a pump is calculated by the rise from the actual pump unit weather its in the pond or out of pond. If the pump is on the floor say and only pumping across on a horizontal and totally level then there is no physical head but thats when pipe restrictions and back pressure from entering a pond level 1m higher than the outlet plays a part. (I was a marine engineer mechanic in the RN where pumps are a very big thing in numerous areas of enginneering and something i spent alot of time working on, centrifugal and reciprocating etc.. most and a much larger scale than any of us pondys come across Out with the old, in with the new.)


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  7. #44
    need to update this because I got the pump flows wrong, I forgot I was draining the drum too which holds 120 litres

  8. #45
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Adult Champion pip895's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lee63 View Post
    The other one that makes me cringe is how many people believe that a pumps head is only from the surface of the pond water Out with the old, in with the new.. The head on a pump is calculated by the rise from the actual pump unit weather its in the pond or out of pond.
    I'm a bit confused by this -Total pump head is the sum of suction and discharge pressure. So if you have a pump directly in some water pumping in to a pipe the head of water is how high the water can be pumped above the water surface. That height wont change if the pump is two meters down or a foot down. If the pump is outside the pond it makes no difference provided the losses on the input side are low eg you are using 4" bottom drain pipe with a short run - the head will be only slightly lower than if the pump was in the pond.

    Obviously if you put a sieve or even a drum between the drain and the pump then you cant make this assumption - you can presumably approximate based on the working height of the water in the output chamber of the filter though. For example if the output chamber of your drum is a foot down from the level in the pond, then the head of the pump relative to the pond will be a foot lower. The position of the pump doesn't come in to it though does it??

    I have no professional expertise in this area - just A level physics a long time a go lol.
    6000g unheated in ground koi pond
    +3000g lily/Anoxic pond attached
    26 koi (25 to 60cm)
    Bottom drain & Skimmer to Drum QK50 - PondXpert Variflow 30000 to 30" Lacron with 200 ltr micro K1
    Blue eco pump to MB, returned via Anoxic pond (30 baskets)

  9. #46
    Great video, you’ve sold me on the jbr bio chamber !!!!

  10. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by familyman View Post
    some eye opening flow test results!.

    i have a superfish 15,000 and an aqua forte dm vario 20,000 drawing from the bio chamber, both return over the shower at 2 m height, or 1m above water level, the aqua forte pumps pipe run is all in 2 inch pressure pipe and has no other restrictions, all bends are swept bends and its a fairly short pipe run. The superfish pumps pipe run is in 1.5 inch pressure pipe and has the uv and heat pump as 2 major flow restrictions.
    I know my bio chamber holds 1,200 litres and its 100cm tall, so a 10 cm water level drop equates to a 120 litres of water pumped out, so simply time how long it pumps to drop a set level to work out flow rates.

    The superfish pump on its own is pumping just 3,700 lph

    The aquaforte pump on its own, running at 30 % is pumping 2,500 lph and using 25 watts

    the aquaforte pump on its own, running at 65% flow is pumping 6,200 lph and using 86 watts

    as above but running at 100 % flow is pumping 10,400 lph and using 200 watts

    both pumps combined total flow of 14,100 lph

    previous to my filter upgrade i was running a superfish 12,000 and a superfish 15,000, i can see now that combined they were only flowing between 8 - 9,000 lph

    Im thinking many people are actually flowing nowhere near what they think or hope they are flowing!, if your unsure what your flowing i would advise you to measure it, your filter might not be getting half the flow you would like it too.
    David

    as I said these figures are wrong because I didn't realise initially that draining the bio chamber and timing a certain depth drop, wasn't accurate because it was also draining the drum filter of an extra 120 litres.

    I retested twice and I seem to be getting a flow of 22,500 lph give or take, thats with the vario flow pump running at 90 %....which is a whole lot better than I initially thought.

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