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Thread: How many drains / drums?
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26-09-2018, 01:20 AM #21
Like you say, you could separate it out into maybe 6/7 different ponds with a path spiralling in towards a seating area in the middle, you could alternate between koi and bog / anoxic ponds but give the effect that it’s continuous. You could even have it stepped from top pond down to bottom and pump fed back up which would allow you to utilise the bog filter effectively and all the crud would filter down to the bottom pond and be collected in a large drum. Just a thought
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26-09-2018, 01:25 AM #22
How many drains / drums?
Couldn’t find a pic of what I was thinking so this will have to do
The soil is the water and could be sectioned off as it comes down with it overflowing into the next section. But on an epic scale...
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26-09-2018, 01:54 AM #23
Re your garden/pond design.
I love Japanese Zen Gardens and given the space/time/capital would have one. I have a couple of inspirational books that I love thumbing through. Water features many times. One in particular - Zen Gardens by Erik Borja may give you some ideas. Costs £2.19 used from Amazon.
Kenny
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27-09-2018, 11:25 PM #24
Thanks for your thoughts guys. I like the zen gardens too, plenty on YouTube. I also like a lot of the garden features from “Greg the pond guy” from Aquascapes, so I’m busy consuming those and screen grabbing images of bits I like! Thanks for the tip on the book too.
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09-07-2019, 01:03 AM #25
Time to resurrect this old thread. We’ve pretty much agreed on a design for the garden now. It’s all subject to costing and budgets though, so some of the elements may get canned or deferred in phases. Good news, the pond size has come down a fair bit. Surface area is 41.5m2 now I believe, and that’s without allowing the widths of wall construction etc. So this size will come down a little further. I’m thinking we will end up at about 60k litres.
The Gazebo / Deck and pond are pretty much confirmed as a phase 1 though. Still lots to plan, drainage, irrigation, plant location, lighting, cabling, planting, the list goes on.....
I really need to plan the location of the filter room. It’s either going under the deck next to the pond or possibly in a room under the undercover seating area / changing room nearer the pool. Concern with the later is distance, but I potentially can create one room for both the pool and pond plant. I am also planning on a heat pump which will be used for the pond in deep winter and the pool for the rest of the year. I could put a dedicated flow / pump on for this purpose though if required as it will only be used to add heat in winter. Note that the heat pump will be located near the hot tub, not where it is currently shown on the drawing.
The drawing doesn’t show any height currently, I have asked for some 3d work to be done to determine the levels in the garden. It’s pretty flat currently and I want to introduce some character, so the plan is to take the dirt the we dig out and bank the area behind the pond up to the rear boundary. Any further excess can be spread in the field next door.
Im still thinking that it might be worth having a duel drum / filter setup for redundancy and without getting the crayons out, I’m thinking 4 drains and 4 skimmers (maybe 3 of each), but with a twin setup, I’d run two of each to each drum. If I can, I’ll find a way to get a shower on each also, probably over the bio, but these are likely going to come above deck level so I need to find a way to disguise them.
I do have a question about pumps, obviously I want to be able to turn over 30-60k per hour, so need to plan capacity wise for the higher figure. What is the view on number of pumps to achieve this? Ignore the shower as this will be pumping over the filtration independently most likely. Would you go for something like 4 x 20k pumps (2 fitted to each drum/filter). Any recommendations on pumps of this volume for efficiency? Ideally would want variable flow for control.
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09-07-2019, 05:32 PM #26
Wow, that looks pretty stunning!
If you’re going large then flowfriends all the way. They’ll probably pay you back in saved electricity over time.
If they’re a bit steep, then the Auga varioflows are beasts.
Are you developing the house as well?
(I’m just being nosey, I do love a “Grand Designs” project”).
We work for all manner of contractors who install whizzy MVHR systems/swimming pools etc so get involved in some nice projects. Probably one of the most interesting recently was for a professional poker player who is building a giant basement under his tennis courts next to “Wimbledon”. No idea what the total budget it but it’s got lots of 000000’s pretty cool but no koi pond which loses him some points lol
We are sort of looking for another project as I have some ideas floating around my head for a modern boxy house with lots of glass, preferably on the banks of a river however, without moving away from Surrey/Hampshire/Berkshire, it’s unlikely we’ll be able to find a plot we could actually afford unless we suddenly win the lottery and I’m not moving too far as it’s too cold past Watford and they talk funny
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09-07-2019, 06:01 PM #27
Thanks. I figured Flowfriends might still be best. I looked into them a couple of years back, will check out the Auga Varioflows too.
Are you developing the house as well?
(I’m just being nosey, I do love a “Grand Designs” project”).
We work for all manner of contractors who install whizzy MVHR systems/swimming pools etc so get involved in some nice projects. Probably one of the most interesting recently was for a professional poker player who is building a giant basement under his tennis courts next to “Wimbledon”. No idea what the total budget it but it’s got lots of 000000’s pretty cool but no koi pond which loses him some points lol
Unfortunately, the garden had to be put on hold and the koi lives in a large show vat for 2 years and now in a quarantine tank in the garage.
We also replaced the heating system with ground source heating (requiring a 3 phase power supply upgrade) and then at the end of last year added 25kW of solar panels. I have a fair amount of monitoring equipment on the electricity and with the home automation have been programming some efficiency in.
I’m planning to include all the pond, pool and garden equipment using the house automation and some programming for optimum use of excess solar generation during the day which will be interesting.
We are sort of looking for another project as I have some ideas floating around my head for a modern boxy house with lots of glass, preferably on the banks of a river
however, without moving away from Surrey/Hampshire/Berkshire, it’s unlikely we’ll be able to find a plot we could actually afford unless we suddenly win the lottery and I’m not moving too far as it’s too cold past Watford and they talk funny
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09-07-2019, 08:19 PM #28
I’m sure it’ll all look marvellous when it’s done. It’s surprising how you get used to the building site life eh?
My in laws place has has been like that for 15 years. MIL wants a new kitchen but the first one hasn’t been finished yet lol. I can’t ever remember her having proper worktop!!
Just before Clare and I got married, we moved this gigantic piece of glass into the hallway and her Dad was going to get it sorted for the shower screen as they were having wedding guests stay at their place. Anyway, we’ve been married 11 years and it’s still there. We sent it a 10 year anniversary card last year...we thought it was hilarious but the FIL wasn’t too enamoured
Keep us posted, it’ll be great to see it progress.
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10-07-2019, 03:51 PM #29
Just had a refresh on the FlowFriend pump specs. I didn't realise they were 3 inch inlet and outlet, I thought they were 2 inch. Seems from the flow rates advertised that I would only need 1 on each drum / bio filter setup. .
Mind you, they look to be around £1700 each!
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10-07-2019, 04:35 PM #30
Quite possibly, they’re the Rolls Royce of koi pond pumps. Plenty of YouTube stuff about them.
Most of us can only afford the Austin Allegro of pumps so we have to dream about flowfriends lol
My Augas are a decent compromise I believe between power/cost and power consumption.
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21-09-2019, 10:40 PM #31
Well, things have been underway for a few weeks. Pretty much decided to go down the ICF route, so fairly unique.
Currently just having the full pond modelled in 3D for manufacturing accuracy as the walls will be pre-formed to the curves required. The glass is going to be done in 3 straight sections to reduce cost as the curved version is just too damn expensive.
So far the builders (and I’m doing some work, not just making tea!) have cleared out all the areas we needed to and replaced all the fencing with 2/3 sleepers 1/3 panel on half the garden and steel/sleepers on the other half for the retaining areas.
We marked out the garden using the plans and have now put 3 bases in for the Gazebo, Hot Tub and Pool House.
We’ve also started to remove some of the existing patio to reshape it as per the new plans. This has turned out to be a bit of an ar$e as whoever built the patio went a bit overboard. Under the sandstone slabs is 4” of sand / cement bedding and between 6 - 12” of blue cement! So whereas we expected to remove this with a breaker, we ended up hiring a pecker for the digger and have spent a lot of time breaking this out and moving it out of the way.
So no pond pics just yet, as we’re not quite at that stage but we’re not too far off now. Hoping to place the order for the ICF next week and confirm lead times.
Off to the All England Show tomorrow and make a decision on drum(s)!
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26-09-2019, 10:25 PM #32
Figured I'd take a picture of the ridiculous depth of my patio foundations....
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26-09-2019, 10:29 PM #33
Poor little Kubota, have sent it back now... We need a bigger one!
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Section of patio broken up ready to move
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And now I have this lot to dispose of (and I've started another pile up on the garden)
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26-09-2019, 10:35 PM #34
Had a good day out at the All England Show too, took my wife and kids for the first time, my eldest daughter quite enjoyed it, my youngest was just being a nutter as usual!
Took my Mum and Dad too, it was Dad's birthday as it usually is on the show weekend and treated him to one of the koi plaques from VDN. I love the Japanese garden ornaments, got a bit carried away and bought a few bits myself! The dragon at the back of his stand was amazing, would love to be able to fit it in somewhere / afford it!
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26-09-2019, 10:35 PM #35
Someone would prob take that for hardcore
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26-09-2019, 10:37 PM #36
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26-09-2019, 10:50 PM #37
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26-09-2019, 10:59 PM #38
Had a fairly lengthy discussion with Darren and some of his colleagues from Absolute Koi on their stand re Profi Drum.
Hi recommendations for a 60k + pond was to fit 2x Combi 50 units. The Profi Drum is more expensive than other drums, but seems to be very well made and has good feedback. I know that I could buy two drums and separate bio, so I'm considering that also, but I do like the simplicity of the all in one unit. I need to plan my filter pit ASAP!
Options thus far
Bio included
2x Profi Combi 50 Plus (double bio chamber) - £10,000 - 100m3
Bio not included
1x Profi Eco 65 - £3,500 - 65m3 (just about cover the pond in 1 hour at max flow)
1x Profi Drum S/Steel 65e - £7,000 - 80m3
2x Profi Eco 55/40 - £6,000 - 70m3
2x Profi Eco 65/40 - £6,500 - 110m3
Obviously 2 units gives me some redundancy also, possibly the option of running only 1 through winter to reduce operating costs.
If you had 2 drums, would you put individual bio units behind them, or one larger shared unit?
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27-09-2019, 07:42 AM #39
As a newbie and no expert but if you have the space, money and chance to do it, I would run 2 separate systems. This would allow the chance to separate both if a service or problem occurs. Also the chance to vary media and experiment
When I’m dead I hope my Mrs doesn’t sell my fishing gear for what I told her they cost!
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27-09-2019, 10:49 AM #40
Yeah I think 2 drums is sensible, just a bit more expensive. I might have a play with a design of a large bio chamber that can be segregated for the two drums or merged by removing a partition in case one of the drums is out of action.
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Aquaforte Dm vario 20000 pumps
Still for sale. Postage available for cost Sent from my SM-S901B using Tapatalk