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  1. #21
    Banned Rank = Mature Champion Trace's Avatar
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    I think it's probably still down to your Nitrite reading and I would expect to see regular lazy flashing while that's still showing.

    But here's how I do scrapes ... similar to Freddie but I've given a very detailed description of how and why .....

    https://www.koiforum.uk/koi-health-d...us-scrape.html


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  3. #22
    Senior Member Rank = Nanasai Gray's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by freddyboy View Post
    Best to make sure. I thought they had stopped flashing mate. Something ain't right.

    Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk
    I thought they had too but after spending a few hours on the phone for work sat by the pond I could see they hadn’t sadly! As you say, something ain’t right.

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  5. #23
    Senior Member Rank = Nanasai Gray's Avatar
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    Flashing Koi, water looking good?!?

    Cheers Fred & Trace. Top info and guidance as always. Thank you.

    I’ve replaced 1,200 gallons today of my total of 3,850 so that’s a 30% change. Pretty big I guess but hopefully that will prove/disprove any water theories.

    The tap water around here is pretty good for ponds as all the parameters are about right. Put it all through a dechlorinator as usual.

    If they still flash then a precautionary scrape is in order just to be 100%.

    I’m hoping it’s just the Nitrite giving them an itch as you said Trace. Flashing Koi, water looking good?!?

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  7. #24
    Banned Rank = Mature Champion Trace's Avatar
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    I'm still pretty sure it's the Nitrite but a bit of scraping practice won't go amiss ... be interesting to see the results.

    Do you have a suitable microscope with a moveable slide stage?


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  9. #25
    Senior Member Rank = Nanasai Gray's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trace View Post
    I'm still pretty sure it's the Nitrite but a bit of scraping practice won't go amiss ... be interesting to see the results.

    Do you have a suitable microscope with a moveable slide stage?

    Yes, I’ve got a scope but not sure of the workings. I need to get it out and have a look. It was my Dad’s and he never spent cheap so I’d guess it’s got all the necessary ‘stuff’.

    I’ll get it out of the box shortly and see!

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  11. #26
    Banned Rank = Mature Champion Trace's Avatar
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    What you need is a "mechanical stage" ... what that means is that when you have placed the slide on the stage under the lens you can then move the stage about forwards, backwards and side to side with two knobs so you can search the entire slide while still keeping the lens focussed. ...

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  13. #27
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion freddyboy's Avatar
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    My scope only goes up and down.
    I have to move the slide side to side by hand.
    But after a few goes I got the hang of it.
    I have moved the top slide by accident though. To rough. I had to be more gentle
    Haha
    Good luck mate. I also feel it could be nitrite.
    Are they flashing hard or just flicking.
    My two times I have had parasites is my fish leaping out the water continuously.
    They leap now and again say after a big feed. Or catching flying or insects.
    But they are gentle leaps. When carrying parasites they came out like missiles.
    If that makes sense


    Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

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  15. #28
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion freddyboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trace View Post
    I think it's probably still down to your Nitrite reading and I would expect to see regular lazy flashing while that's still showing.

    But here's how I do scrapes ... similar to Freddie but I've given a very detailed description of how and why .....

    https://www.koiforum.uk/koi-health-d...us-scrape.html

    Good write up that. Nice one.

    Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

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  17. #29
    Senior Member Rank = Nanasai Gray's Avatar
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    Here’s the scope I’ve got.

    Seems it has the mechanical stage as there’s various screws to move the stage around.

    The lenses in it say, 90x1.25, 40x0.65 and 9x0.2

    Seems to have a large box of slides with it too and some vials.


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  19. #30
    Senior Member Rank = Nanasai Gray's Avatar
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    Had a chance to sit and watch the Koi after they had a feed. I saw only one lazy flash and I’m debating if that was to disturb the bottom.

    The Koi that did it on the floor gave a flick and then immediately turned around and starting snuffling around the debris it had kicked up.

    Aside from that, no full on flashes.

    I’m hoping, based on this, that Trace is right and the Nitrite was giving a few of them an itch.

    Will keep watching and tomorrow I’m going to do a full test and see where I’m at.

    Flashing Koi, water looking good?!?Flashing Koi, water looking good?!?

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  21. #31
    Banned Rank = Mature Champion Trace's Avatar
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    Gray if it was me ... from what your saying about the infrequent lazy flashing I would just leave the fish and keep watching and testing the water ... until you have zero Ammonia & Nitrite ... then if they keep flashing I would investigate further.

    Obviously though if they start flashing aggressively then that'll be different .. but water tests are where all diagnosis starts ... and Nitrite is a major irritation for fish.

    Your scope looks good ... a vintage russian Lomo Biolam: Micscape Microscopy and Microscope Magazine

    What you want is a lens + eye piece combo that gives you around x200 magnification ... with that you can easily spot all the common nasties ...

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  23. #32
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion freddyboy's Avatar
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    Agree with trace. Sounds like nitrite .
    I get the odd flash during and after feeds.
    Nothing mental though. Then about an hour later stops.
    I have a few doitsu. And there the ones that flash the most.
    Maybe because of less scaling.
    Who knows. Keep a good eye on them mate. Which you are doing.


    Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

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  25. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Gray View Post
    Had a chance to sit and watch the Koi after they had a feed. I saw only one lazy flash and I’m debating if that was to disturb the bottom.

    The Koi that did it on the floor gave a flick and then immediately turned around and starting snuffling around the debris it had kicked up.

    Aside from that, no full on flashes.



    I’m hoping, based on this, that Trace is right and the Nitrite was giving a few of them an itch.

    Will keep watching and tomorrow I’m going to do a full test and see where I’m at.

    Flashing Koi, water looking good?!?Flashing Koi, water looking good?!?
    You can add some salt to the pond to protect the fish from the nitrite, I had to do this a few weeks ago as mine had gotten to 2.5 ppm.. My pond is 2,500 gallons and I added 10 lbs which put the salt content to .05% and the 1 fish that was flashing quit.. A week later and there were no nitrites when testing as the pond has finally fully cycled now..

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  27. #34
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion RS2OOO's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by freddyboy View Post
    When I bowl mine for a scrape. I put half the depth of water for the koi body.
    Also give them a spin four or five times like make them dizzy. Then turn upside down.



    Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk
    Best post I've read all day.

    Reminds me of when I went on the waltzers and the attendant took a liking to me. She was only small but bloody hell did she have some spinning strength.
    I was sick for 2 days!

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  29. #35
    Senior Member Rank = Nanasai Gray's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by trapper View Post
    You can add some salt to the pond to protect the fish from the nitrite, I had to do this a few weeks ago as mine had gotten to 2.5 ppm.. My pond is 2,500 gallons and I added 10 lbs which put the salt content to .05% and the 1 fish that was flashing quit.. A week later and there were no nitrites when testing as the pond has finally fully cycled now..
    Cheers Trapper. I’ll look in to the salt. Thank you.

    I’ve got a few plants in there so will need to move those out before salting.

    Fun & games!

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  31. #36
    Senior Member Rank = Nanasai Gray's Avatar
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    Flashing Koi, water looking good?!?

    So, here's the scores on the doors. First from 5th July and second yesterday (7th July):

    NH3 - (was) 0 - (now) 0.3
    NO2 - (was) 0.25 - (now) 0.25
    PH - (was) 8.5 - (now) 8.75 (up a bit from before possibly due to adding some bicarb to increase KH?)
    GH - (was) 5 - (now) 8
    KH - (was) 7 - (now) 8
    NO3 - (was) 0.5 - (now) 0.3
    PO4 - 5 - still the same

    Not too sure what to make of this as I would have hoped the Nitrate would have gone up versus down with the Nitrite dropping a bit too.

    Hmmm.

    Going to check the water temp tonight as I also feel the Ammonia is a little higher than ideal with a PH of 8.75.

    All comments always welcomed!!!
    Last edited by Gray; 08-07-2019 at 11:20 PM.

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  33. #37
    Banned Rank = Mature Champion Trace's Avatar
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    I would expect to see some lazy flashing from your water results ... what is your water temp? your getting close to the max. NH3 that the fish can stand ... so depending on the temperature I would stop feeding.

    How often are you water changing?

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  35. #38
    Senior Member Rank = Nanasai Gray's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trace View Post
    I would expect to see some lazy flashing from your water results ... what is your water temp? your getting close to the max. NH3 that the fish can stand ... so depending on the temperature I would stop feeding.

    How often are you water changing?
    Checked and the temp is 19-20deg at midnight tonight. So I’m over the ideal ~0.2 for NH3 I believe having just looked at a chart. I’ll stop feeding as you say.

    Changed around 25%-30% of the water at the weekend and today I ditched two Nexus 320’s worth of water via the cleaning cycles.

    I could trickle in/out as I have an overflow to the field. Would that help at all?

    Tap water here is pretty good. 7.5 PH and KH of 6 if I remember correctly.

    Or do something else?

    Thanks in advance as always.

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  37. #39
    Senior Member Rank = Nanasai Gray's Avatar
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    Latest update. Tested tonight after not feeding since 5pm’ish yesterday.

    PH has dropped to 8.5 from 8.75

    KH holding at 8

    Ammonia gone down to 0 (phew!)

    Nitrate is showing 0 (was hoping to see a small increase)

    Nitrite is still at 0.25

    So some of the parameters have gone the right way, mainly the ammonia has dropped right off which I’m pleased about as that was a worry, but still not 100%.

    Nitrite is still high’ish so I’m going to keep the air on 24/7 and monitor this and not feed for another 24hrs. Flashing Koi, water looking good?!?

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  39. #40
    Senior Member Rank = Supreme Champion freddyboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gray View Post
    Latest update. Tested tonight after not feeding since 5pm’ish yesterday.

    PH has dropped to 8.5 from 8.75

    KH holding at 8

    Ammonia gone down to 0 (phew!)

    Nitrate is showing 0 (was hoping to see a small increase)

    Nitrite is still at 0.25

    So some of the parameters have gone the right way, mainly the ammonia has dropped right off which I’m pleased about as that was a worry, but still not 100%.

    Nitrite is still high’ish so I’m going to keep the air on 24/7 and monitor this and not feed for another 24hrs. Flashing Koi, water looking good?!?
    That's good mate shows your filters are doing there job mate. Plus your helping with water changes. What's your nitrite reading on the tap hose end mate.
    The filters still ain't fully mature yet. But you are slowly getting there.
    Like I once told you it takes quite a while.
    On both my systems tank and pond.
    I got a really big spike in nitrite. And that's when the nitrate came in the tests mate.
    Also your plants will be eating the nitrate s
    Up
    That's why I put a top pond in the system
    For phosphate s and nitrates.
    Keep up the good work mate your doing it the right way.

    Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

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