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  1. #1
    Junior Member Rank = Fry JimJones's Avatar
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    koi tail fin rot progressing to boy lost 2 fish help

    Hi everyone

    lost two fish due to tail fin rot that seems to then infect the rest of the fish where the tail fin meets the body.

    water params are fine and i have done scrapes and sent them to a vet who did not find anything.

    When temp last month were over 12 degrees i treated the pond with FMG as another fish who has now recovered had cotton wool fungus on his dorsal fin and i thought the fomalin would kill off any parasites in the water.


    i currently have two fish that are sick and have been treating them every 4 days with roccol wound cleaner then sealer then oraheiseve powder but this is no longer keeping pace.

    I have begun injecting 5% Baytril after consulting with a vet but one of my fish now has the raised scales and the beginnings of blood in the skin and fins that led to the death of my last fish.

    Can someone lease offer my any help

    DSC_4212.jpg

    i have no quarantine tank the photo is of the fish that died recently.

    thanks

    Jim

    Ps pond is 4000 gallons multibay with moving k1 japp matt alfragrog and shower on skimmer

    main pond 12k ltrs per hour skimmer over shower 12kltrs per hour 55 watt uv.
    Filter cleaned regularly.



  2. #2
    Moderator Rank = Grand Champion Feline's Avatar
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    Fin rot generally has a bacterial cause, and as you have found can turn to septicaemia and dropsy eventually which is fatal.
    Firstly, have you introduced any new fish in recent months?
    Has your water quality been consistently good or have you experienced any problems in the past few months that could have left the fish susceptible?

    Next thing to consider is whether there could be festering material lurking somewhere in your pond and filter system. I would give your multibay a really thorough clean by removing all of the media to check underneath it, and checking any nooks and crannies in the pond. Do you have a liner? Has your pond got bottom drains and if so do you regularly purge them?

    The best treatment for bacterial problems is heat, salt, and something antibacterial such as Chloramine T or Acriflavine in the water. This is more easily done in the quarantine tank if you have one. Plus antibiotics for the worst affected fish. Ideally antibiotic choice would be based on a culture and sensitivity. Your vet could arrange to send some swabs off to a lab for that for you. Baytril is not the best choice for all bacteria.

  3. #3
    Junior Member Rank = Fry JimJones's Avatar
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    thank you for your reply yes you are right and i have already cleaned out the multibay but yes i could inspect the liner for any trapped debris but so far have not seen anything to make it seem the obvious chhoice.

    You say Batryl is not the best choice - what is please so i can get in touch with the vet.

    Cannot use Chloramine T as pond temp is below 10 degress at present and i have no quarrantine tank.

    going to continue with my wound sealing treatments as it could be helping the fish out on some level.

    thank you

    Jim

  4. #4
    Moderator Rank = Grand Champion Feline's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimJones View Post
    thank you for your reply yes you are right and i have already cleaned out the multibay but yes i could inspect the liner for any trapped debris but so far have not seen anything to make it seem the obvious chhoice.

    You say Batryl is not the best choice - what is please so i can get in touch with the vet.

    Cannot use Chloramine T as pond temp is below 10 degress at present and i have no quarrantine tank.

    going to continue with my wound sealing treatments as it could be helping the fish out on some level.

    thank you

    Jim
    When I say Bayril is not always the best choice, I dont mean that it’s never the best. Its just without a culture and sensitivity you cannot know, If the bacteria you have are not covered well by Bayri’s spectrum of activity or bacteria have resistance to it alreadyl thne it will not work. Same goes for any antibiotic.

    Even if you cannot add CT, salt will help. I would salt to 0.3%, monitor for a few days, then increase salt to 0.6%. Its best to have a salinity meter for this so you know how much to add when you change water. People have made cockups by not knowing their pond volume accurately enough when relying on weight only.

  5. #5
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    Oh yeah, and the other thing to consider is that injectable antibiotics are simply not effective at low temps. You really need temps of 15C or above to get a good response unfortunately.

  6. #6
    Junior Member Rank = Fry JimJones's Avatar
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    Not my day i guess

    still trying my best

    have order salt meter and more salt ( can come in handy for salt baths)

    was thinking of diluting out the salt i have in there now and permanganating the pond as that will work at low temps

    what do you think ?

    thanks

    Jim

  7. #7
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    I would strongly advise against using PP. Its the wrong product for the job, and would be extremely harsh on fish desperately trying to heal in low temperature comditions. You need them to keep their barrier mucus intact as much as possible right now and not do damage to it.

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  9. #8
    Junior Member Rank = Fry JimJones's Avatar
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    how long do you advise keeping the salt level at 0.6 for ?

    thanks again for the help

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    Quote Originally Posted by JimJones View Post
    how long do you advise keeping the salt level at 0.6 for ?

    thanks again for the help
    I would maintain 0.6% for a few weeks whilst I monitored the progress of the affected fish. Once things have significantly improved you could then start gradually reducing it again (with water changes). It takes quite some time to get rid of entirely under the laws of diminishing returns.

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  12. #10
    I'm currently repairing my pond and my fish ( a few comets and several koi) are in a large holding tank however I discovered that the comets and one butterfly koi have lost alot of scales and their fins are quite baldly torn. I've removed the injured fish and put them in a quarantine tank and treated them with some bio elite heal it all. Most of the fish seem fine now but I'm extremely worried and I'm not sure what else I can do.

  13. #11
    In order to help you, the first thing to establish is that the water parameters are within acceptable limits. Can you tell us what are the values?

  14. #12
    The ph is nuetral about 7.5 and I've had a heater with a temperature of 27 degrees celcius. But unfortunately the black comet just died this morning although the butterly koi seems fairly fine now its just that quite a bit of its scales are missing and I want to know how I can safely prevent further infection and promote scale regeneration. Thank you

  15. #13
    All the fish are in a stable position or well they seem to be. There is also no sign of fungus om any of the fish its just a break or lack of skin and fim tissue. Before the black comet was dead it was stiff and unable to move it just gasped and drifted around against the current.
    Last edited by Kowen30; 16-01-2019 at 07:27 PM.

 

 

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