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  1. #1

    Somethings WrongSomethings Wrong[emoji3525]

    Just as I thought everything was going smoothly on this new pond. Looks like its starting to go T**TS up...

    So my parameters were starting to look good so i purchased 2 new fish... see my previous post...

    Anyways last couple of days... seen a few of the fish flashing... and 2 of them now look in a bad way..... really lethargic... fins clamped... pretty much dorment and stressed in corner.. im pretty sure its a parasite issue... as my parameters are pretty good..

    heres a recap...

    pond - 5500 litres... Bottom drain feeding nexus then UV then return... approx 2months old..

    water parameters are pretty good.. I have posted them before... but latest are..

    KH 5
    PH 8.2
    AMMO- 0 TO 0.25PPM
    NITRITE - 0PPM
    NITRATE - 5PPM

    GH- 2DROPS THIS IS QUITE LOW BUT NOT SURE IF IT WOULD HAVE AN EFFECT.

    The problem seems to have arrived since adding new fish.
    Still have no quarantine yet as pretty new to this and was kind of hoping to build this hobby up slowly but surely..

    Any advice be great... Is there any general quick treatment to use.. or as i have read on many a thread, would you recommend buying a microscope and scraping.. bearing in mind this may take a few days to arrive... are the fish going to get worse by then.... the fish affected are in photo attached..

    Im absolutely gutted. Somethings Wrong[emoji3525]

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  2. #2
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Hassai Scamp's Avatar
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    Hi I would scape and scope first, as could be a range of parasites, and some treatments are more suitable than others per bug...if ammonia is 0.25 that’s a tad high...I would cut back on food..while you ascertain issue..do you water change via trickle in, and what’s your temperature? Sorry not sure how many koi you have in the 1200 gallons? I wouldn’t beat yourself up over lack of QT many of us don’t have them ( but wished we did)...

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  4. #3
    Moderator Rank = Supreme Champion Feline's Avatar
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    It would be worth testing your pH at a few different times of day to check it's not swinging. It seems quite high considering your KH is 2. Koi can adapt well to any pH in the 7-8.5 range but they hate fluctuations.
    How well aerated if your pond?

    Finally where did you buy the fish from? A good dealer might offer to help you out with scrapes while you get set up to do it.

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  6. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Scamp View Post
    Hi I would scape and scope first, as could be a range of parasites, and some treatments are more suitable than others per bug...if ammonia is 0.25 thatís a tad high...I would cut back on food..while you ascertain issue..do you water change via trickle in, and whatís your temperature? Sorry not sure how many koi you have in the 1200 gallons? I wouldnít beat yourself up over lack of QT many of us donít have them ( but wished we did)...
    I would try pick up a cheap fish tank of gum tree or sphock and remove from pond while your waiting for scope to prevent really I'll fish breeding more parasites and also would be easier to maintain water temp and treatment dose in more confined area till you know what your dealing with, Qt doesn't need to be massive and expensive to do it's job, 2 ft tank should be fine in my opinion aslong as filterd ect

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  8. #5
    Moderator Rank = Supreme Champion Feline's Avatar
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    If you don't have mature filtration on a QT then it needs to be large with big water changes, the last thing a sick fish needs is ammonia and nitrite building up in there IMO.

    Since this is a new pond with not many fish I cannot see any reason to take the fish out of there and subject them to additional stress currently.
    What kind of dechlorinator are you using?

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  10. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Scamp View Post
    Hi I would scape and scope first, as could be a range of parasites, and some treatments are more suitable than others per bug...if ammonia is 0.25 thatís a tad high...I would cut back on food..while you ascertain issue..do you water change via trickle in, and whatís your temperature? Sorry not sure how many koi you have in the 1200 gallons? I wouldnít beat yourself up over lack of QT many of us donít have them ( but wished we did)...
    hi scamp....
    ammonia down to zero now... been doing 10 % water changes for a few days... and cutting down on food.. I have not got a microscope yet... but am in the process of purchasing one.. any recommendations would be great...

    but the time it takes for one to arrive would be days.. so i was thinking is there justva general medication i can use that might just work...

    thanks Ryan

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  11. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Feline View Post
    It would be worth testing your pH at a few different times of day to check it's not swinging. It seems quite high considering your KH is 2. Koi can adapt well to any pH in the 7-8.5 range but they hate fluctuations.
    How well aerated if your pond?

    Finally where did you buy the fish from? A good dealer might offer to help you out with scrapes while you get set up to do it.
    Hi feline...

    KH is 5...and PH is 8.2..

    but normally test in evening...

    as for aeration... only currently have 120lpm evo pump feeding nexus 210.. got nothing in the pond... but it is a small pond... and fish seemed fine until i added 2 newbies last weekend.... started flashing pretty much since they were added..

    the new fish were from a branch of maidenhead near us... not many koi suppliers near south wales that i am aware of... so they have pretty much been my go to for stocking...

    cheers
    ry

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  13. #8
    also... i am using st crystals diluted down as a dechlorinator as per discussion on here.... my water levels seem fine other than the low gh....

    i have been using sodium bicarb to raise kh... and this has gradually risen kh from 1 to 5 over a few weeks... ph has risen 7.8 to 8.2 in this time....

    so im guessing its a parasite...

    im a bit worried about netting and putting the bigger of the fishes in QT as he is a big fish....and the time i purchase an aquarium and accesories it may be too late

    i was hoping to treat the pond as a few of the others are flashing also..

    i was reseraching potassium prompergate.. not sure thats how u spell it... i know this is only suitable for certain parasites.. but the time I wait for a microscope to be delivered to confirm parasite the fish could die.. so was hoping i could get the treatment off the shelf and treat the lot 2moro...

    ta ryan

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  15. #9
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Supreme Champion Davej's Avatar
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    Hi

    The first season with a new pond is always the most difficult.

    Are the grumpy fish the new additions or ones that you have had in before?

    The issue with having a guess as what treatment to add is 1) they may not need any 2) if they do and you add the wrong one it can a) set them back b) potentially compromise your treatment of the right medication when the problem is identified.

    If you can try and source a scope, Apex practioner is up to the job, there are several others. Yes there is a learning curve with this but going forward it will serve you in good stead.

    If there are any local koi guys who are willing to help you and take a scrape this would be great, if by that time you have your own scope you get the chance to compare what things look like with your scope against their one

    Joining a local club is great way of finding local koi nuts and building up a support network (we all need them).

    Speak to the supplier, flag the problem and ask if they can assist with a scrape, but please don't get fobbed off with the suggestion to add any meds without ID of the problem.

    Good luck

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  17. #10
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Nanasai anne's Avatar
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    Ryan don't forget your new '' Sterlet '' regarding any treatment you may be advised to use.
    .…….Hope you get sorted.....

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  19. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Davej View Post
    Hi

    The first season with a new pond is always the most difficult.

    Are the grumpy fish the new additions or ones that you have had in before?

    The issue with having a guess as what treatment to add is 1) they may not need any 2) if they do and you add the wrong one it can a) set them back b) potentially compromise your treatment of the right medication when the problem is identified.

    If you can try and source a scope, Apex practioner is up to the job, there are several others. Yes there is a learning curve with this but going forward it will serve you in good stead.

    If there are any local koi guys who are willing to help you and take a scrape this would be great, if by that time you have your own scope you get the chance to compare what things look like with your scope against their one

    Joining a local club is great way of finding local koi nuts and building up a support network (we all need them).

    Speak to the supplier, flag the problem and ask if they can assist with a scrape, but please don't get fobbed off with the suggestion to add any meds without ID of the problem.

    Good luck
    Hi dave...

    yeah the grumpy fish are one of the new ones and one of the older ones... just been out the back now... and neither are eating.... but saw 4 of the other fish flashing like no tommorow.. really horrible to watch... depressing really...

    im going to order a microscope now.. thanks for the advice.. if anyone has any links for a entry level model.. that would be great... im not sure of any members near south wales and i dont anticipate getting much feedback off maidenhead....i learnt the hard way whilst keeping marine fish...

    as Anne stated.. im really nackered with meds as the sterlet has now been added..

    stuck between a rock and a hard place at the minute. Somethings Wrong[emoji3525]

    im not sure they are going to last long at this rate...

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  21. #12
    Senior Member Rank = Jussai Ajm's Avatar
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    With the sterlet he is only small ? As Steve (stuffyrat) said get a cheap tank and get him out that will open treatment up to help get going and sorted and fingers crossed it never happens again but if some it was to happen down the line you would be more prepared as in the scope

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    Johnathan

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  23. #13
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Nanasai anne's Avatar
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    Ryan are you on Facebook ? ( not every ones cup of tea ) BUT just found this for you
    Celtic koi club, south Wales based and they hold meetings at Cardiff yacht club, know it ?, cant find a number
    for you but you can message them on Facebook, hopefully close enough to you for some one to do a scrape
    for you. Quick sharp log in...…………………

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  25. #14
    thanks guys...

    In not on facebook unfortunately... but i did try some googling earlier and Celtic Koi Club came up..... so im going to get my wife to chase it up as shes on facebook.....thanks for all the help... never had one problem with marine fish...

    i thought pond would be a doddle....

    I am going to purchase a microscope.. and take a trip to maidenhead tommorow and see what they advise...booked a night off work.. so free day 2moro...dont know what else i can do at the minute
    ... never been in this position with fish keeping before

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  27. #15
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Nanasai anne's Avatar
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    Get hold of that celtic koi club first and see if some one can get that scrape done for you, nothing against Maidenhead
    Aquatics but think you need to get that scrape done as soon as poss.
    And plenty of air going in for the sterlet, even some air stones dropped in the pond will help .

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  29. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by anne View Post
    Get hold of that celtic koi club first and see if some one can get that scrape done for you, nothing against Maidenhead
    Aquatics but think you need to get that scrape done as soon as poss.
    And plenty of air going in for the sterlet, even some air stones dropped in the pond will help .
    hi anne.. thanks for your replies...
    just contacted our local koi club.. celtic koi...

    im hoping to hear something back... otherwise its a trip to maidenhead in the morn... dont know what else to do.....

    thanks for your help..

    all of you..

    its much appreciated..

    the joy of koi Somethings Wrong[emoji3525]

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  31. #17
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Nanasai anne's Avatar
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    Hopefully somebody will be able to give you some hands on help from the Celtic koi club after all they're Koi
    keepers too...if you don't hear anything from them keep on messaging them, don't give up shame there isn't
    a phone number for them, try not to panic Ryan ( easier said than done ) but I am sure it will come good in the end.

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  33. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by anne View Post
    Hopefully somebody will be able to give you some hands on help from the Celtic koi club after all they're Koi
    keepers too...if you don't hear anything from them keep on messaging them, don't give up shame there isn't
    a phone number for them, try not to panic Ryan ( easier said than done ) but I am sure it will come good in the end.
    Thanks anne...

    I just literally messaged them on my wifes facebook... at 11.45..

    so im guessing may not hear back till 2moro....im online at the minute looking for microscopes.....

    so im learning the hard way...

    wait to see if local koi club get back 2moro..
    fingers crossed..

    thanks for the help though.. Somethings Wrong[emoji3525]

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  35. #19
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Grand Champion john1's Avatar
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    Nice one Anne.
    John

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  37. #20
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Grand Champion john1's Avatar
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    Hi Ryan, Just caught up with all this but agree with Dave j 100% ,dont put any thing in your pond until you find the source.
    I would have gone back to Maidenhead to see what they say sounds like their fault and their stock would be carrying some parasite to other folk.

    Good on Anne to find a club for you great idea.
    For future ref there is a breeder near Newport but I cant remember his name.
    There is Taff valley koi near Camarthen,big breeder with mud ponds etc,I have had some off him in the past and no problems with his fish.
    Hope you get it sorted ok I know it is frustrating but you will get there.

    Looks like your kh is sorted ok.
    John

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