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  1. #1

    Mouth Rot/ Fungus Help

    So I had a nice pair of Shushi Koi purchased for me by my brother as a "sorry" for an accident involving one of my other Koi whilst I was on holiday. Unfortunately, one of them had a small sore on his mouth, so it went straight into the quarantine tank for treatment. Annoyingly, I didnt have an established quarantine tank set up, as I'm in the middle of "new pond" syndrome, so he went in with a dose of NT Labs mouth, fin rot and fungus treatment.

    However, after 11 days, I've seen no improvement what so ever, with the sore/ rot actually considerably worse (will attach pictures later).

    I've been doing daily water changes to try and keep on top of any what quality issues, and for the last week, have been using pure vacuum salt to promote healing.

    I've kept the ammonia and nitrite levels at an acceptable level with the water changes, but my only concern is perhaps the temperature of the water getting a bit too high during the day (highest is 28c), as its currently situated in my garage and this past week or so has been quite warm.

    Does anybody have an effective treatment suggestion/ approach that may help? I dont have access to a microscope, so cannot take a scrape to check for a parasite. However, I'm fairly certain its bacterial, as the fish hasn't displayed any other signs that suggest otherwise (flashing, clamped fins etc).

    It's still eating well enough, at the moment, so hoping it can be saved.

    Thanks,

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  2. #2
    Unable to upload directly, so here's a Google drive link: https://drive.google.com/folderview?...s_u9CSuWMig_f1

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  3. #3
    Moderator Rank = Supreme Champion Feline's Avatar
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    It's always incredibly difficult to diagnose these things accurately from a photo- but from what I can see there it does look like that koi might have started with a carp pox lesion but it's become infected.

    Personally I would take a 2 pronged attack to the problem:

    1. I would treat topically- so sedate the fish and debride/cauterise and seal the affected tissue (there is. a koi ulcer kit available with the necessary products if you don't own any topicals yet, or visit Product Page who have some excellent individual products for sale that are hard to buy elsewhere.

    2. Use heat and salt to aid healing. From what you are saying heat is not a problem. Anything over 28C is really too hot though. I would go up to 0.6% salt, buy a salt meter because with water changes you will never know what the content is otherwise. Since you don't have a mature filter on your QT to knock back you could consider adding an antibacterial such as Chloramine T to the water also. You need to really watch the pH if you do this because it is acidic and the KH might need adjusting.

    I would also consider a 3rd prong if things are getting worse- have a culture and sensitivity done from a swab of the affected area, so that antibiotics can be used appropriately and responsibly if necessary. There are fish vets in some parts that can help you with this. https://www.fishvetsociety.org.uk/in...reat-pet-fish/ is a good place to start.

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  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Feline View Post
    It's always incredibly difficult to diagnose these things accurately from a photo- but from what I can see there it does look like that koi might have started with a carp pox lesion but it's become infected.

    Personally I would take a 2 pronged attack to the problem:

    1. I would treat topically- so sedate the fish and debride/cauterise and seal the affected tissue (there is. a koi ulcer kit available with the necessary products if you don't own any topicals yet, or visit Product Page who have some excellent individual products for sale that are hard to buy elsewhere.

    2. Use heat and salt to aid healing. From what you are saying heat is not a problem. Anything over 28C is really too hot though. I would go up to 0.6% salt, buy a salt meter because with water changes you will never know what the content is otherwise. Since you don't have a mature filter on your QT to knock back you could consider adding an antibacterial such as Chloramine T to the water also. You need to really watch the pH if you do this because it is acidic and the KH might need adjusting.

    I would also consider a 3rd prong if things are getting worse- have a culture and sensitivity done from a swab of the affected area, so that antibiotics can be used appropriately and responsibly if necessary. There are fish vets in some parts that can help you with this. https://www.fishvetsociety.org.uk/in...reat-pet-fish/ is a good place to start.
    Thanks for that; I have a topical kit on order that should be arriving tomorrow actually, so I will assess and have a go after work.

    Now that you've mentioned it, does appear to be more like carp pox. I've seen the same sort of spots on fish that cleared up within a few days after a water change and precautionary treatment of the pond a few months ago (as I wasnt sure if it was ich). The affected fish I think were from the same aquatics centre, so it's very possible. I've not seen them turn to sores and get infected though, hence the initial potential miss diagnosis.

    I'll keep you guys updated on how the treatment goes. May land up moving the tank in doors if I cannot keep temps below 28c.

    Thanks again!

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  7. #5
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    Good luck Derp, let us know how you get on!

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  9. #6
    Sadly, my Shushi took a turn for the worst last night and passed away sometime this afternoon. He started hanging by the secondary filter in the tank at the surface, so I knew by then that it was only a matter of time.

    I'm confident that the water quality was not the issue, as the two goldfish I keep in the tank are happily swimming around and feeding like Piranha, as well as ammonia and nitrite parameters being in the low acceptable range. I can only assume that the cause of death was septicaemia from the infection.
    Upon inspection, it appears the infection had managed to kill off best part of the lower jaw and had decayed down to the bone at the front, which appeared to have been broken. I'm curious if the infection alone could have done that, or if he had a pre-existing injury to the mouth which was the cause of all this in the first place.

    Quite upset by it, as it's the second Shushi I've lost in the space of a month. In hindsight, perhaps I should've got my brother to return the fish to the aquatics centre when I noticed the issue on introduction to the quarantine tank, rather than trying to deal with it myself.

    Guess it's all part of the learning curve! Thanks again for the advice and look forward to involving myself in the forum some more in the future under better circumstances Mouth Rot/ Fungus Help




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