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  1. #181
    Senior Member Rank = Mature Champion RS2OOO's Avatar
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    14 weeks old.



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  3. #182
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Grand Champion john1's Avatar
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    Coming along well now Rs,seem to have made a full recovery.

    Are they still in the out side pond?
    John

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  5. #183
    Senior Member Rank = Mature Champion RS2OOO's Avatar
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    Still in the outside pond John.

    Once air temps are consistently below 20C I'll bring them in and turn their pond into the anoxic section.

    The flashing continued and was fairly constant so treated them a couple of weeks ago with Fluke P and the flashing reduced by 90% within 2 days but it rained heavy and diluted the treatment.

    Noticed they were flashing more and more again over the last few days so I done another fluke P treatment just before those pics were taken. It doesn't affect the water clarity and the koi don't react to it at all.

    I suspect there might be some flukes in the main pond too. The only koi that ever flashes is the big Sanke, just a few times a day . Not decided whether to scrape him or whether to just stick a Fluke P dose in there to be certain before winter. Really don't want another spring where I'm fighting both flukes and low temps at the same time. Had that 2 years in a row now and hate having to deal with it.

    Wouldn't consider treating if I was heated, but that Sanke has been heated all it's life till I got it and it really sulked all through last winter so want him as strong as possible this year.


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    Last edited by RS2OOO; 24-08-2019 at 09:03 PM.

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  7. #184
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Grand Champion john1's Avatar
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    So you will bring them into the garage over winter Rs and some heat,something fishy to keep you occupied over the winter.

    I wouldn't worry too much with the odd flash in your main pond as mine do, it's when they are at it all the time and something is really annoying them.
    My little ones arnt flashing so much now,just the odd one so I am not worried.

    Think your Sanke has been spoilt a bit with all the winter heat you will have to harden him up a bit Rs.
    John

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  9. #185
    Quote Originally Posted by RS2OOO View Post
    Still in the outside pond John.

    Once air temps are consistently below 20C I'll bring them in and turn their pond into the anoxic section.

    The flashing continued and was fairly constant so treated them a couple of weeks ago with Fluke P and the flashing reduced by 90% within 2 days but it rained heavy and diluted the treatment.

    Noticed they were flashing more and more again over the last few days so I done another fluke P treatment just before those pics were taken. It doesn't affect the water clarity and the koi don't react to it at all.

    I suspect there might be some flukes in the main pond too. The only koi that ever flashes is the big Sanke, just a few times a day . Not decided whether to scrape him or whether to just stick a Fluke P dose in there to be certain before winter. Really don't want another spring where I'm fighting both flukes and low temps at the same time. Had that 2 years in a row now and hate having to deal with it.

    Wouldn't consider treating if I was heated, but that Sanke has been heated all it's life till I got it and it really sulked all through last winter so want him as strong as possible this year.


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    I would give it a scrape mate. Reason.
    What if it's not flukes. Just to be certain with what your dealing with.

    And the growon fish are coming along nicely mate. Over the moon they have battled through mate.


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  11. #186
    Senior Member Rank = Mature Champion RS2OOO's Avatar
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    Thanks John / Fred,

    Both really helpful posts.

    1) Confirmation that I shouldn't worry too much about the occasional flash.

    2) That I really should scrape rather than go for the lazy approach. My reason for not doing a scrape is that I scraped him 3 times before after loads of flashing and found nothing, then scraped another Koi that occasionally flashed and found loads of flukes.... So Sanke was carrying them after all but I couldn't find them, and I stressed him out a lot by scraping.

    The Sanke has days where he sits on the bottom for a couple of hours, then swims about normal again. He's been like this ever since I had him (10 Months). He's not clamped up or looking poorly etc. At first this worried me, then I got used to it and accepted it.

    When food goes in he'll get up and slowly amble his way over, never in a mad rush, but he never misses a feed, always gets up and comes over for his share.

    Scraped him quite a few times since I had him and never actually found anything, even when I knew he had flukes and I was almost certain he had costia, both of which I treated when I positively ID'd them on other Koi.

    Is it normal to have an odd lazy Koi that sits around a bit now and again, or is it a definite indication of something wrong?

    Because he's always been like this I accepted it, but also you think wait a minute, he wouldn't have grown to 50+ cm if he was lazy like this all his previous life.

    Sometimes fancy goldfish sit on the bottom now and again even though their completely healthy. But I've not seen other Koi do it unless they're not well. Sometimes I wonder if he's just a bit unhappy in my pond, its half the volume of his old home which had strong currents and state of the art filtration, purification and heat pumps.
    Last edited by RS2OOO; 25-08-2019 at 09:02 AM.

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  13. #187
    Quote Originally Posted by RS2OOO View Post
    Thanks John / Fred,

    Both really helpful posts.

    1) Confirmation that I shouldn't worry too much about the occasional flash.

    2) That I really should scrape rather than go for the lazy approach. My reason for not doing a scrape is that I scraped him 3 times before after loads of flashing and found nothing, then scraped another Koi that occasionally flashed and found loads of flukes.... So Sanke was carrying them after all but I couldn't find them, and I stressed him out a lot by scraping.

    The Sanke has days where he sits on the bottom for a couple of hours, then swims about normal again. He's been like this ever since I had him (10 Months). He's not clamped up or looking poorly etc. At first this worried me, then I got used to it and accepted it.

    When food goes in he'll get up and slowly amble his way over, never in a mad rush, but he never misses a feed, always gets up and comes over for his share.

    Scraped him quite a few times since I had him and never actually found anything, even when I knew he had flukes and I was almost certain he had costia, both of which I treated when I positively ID'd them on other Koi.

    Is it normal to have an odd lazy Koi that sits around a bit now and again, or is it a definite indication of something wrong?

    Because he's always been like this I accepted it, but also you think wait a minute, he wouldn't have grown to 50+ cm if he was lazy like this all his previous life.

    Sometimes fancy goldfish sit on the bottom now and again even though their completely healthy. But I've not seen other Koi do it unless they're not well. Sometimes I wonder if he's just a bit unhappy in my pond, its half the volume of his old home which had strong currents and state of the art filtration, purification and heat pumps.
    Going on a couple of my fish. I think they remember certain things. Take my chagoi.
    I used to be able to stroke him on the surface of the water.
    Since I had him out for medical repairs ulcer tail rot.
    I or anyone goes near the pond now he goes down to the bottom. He sees the net he is gone like a shot.
    Them days have gone now with stroking him.
    If i turn the air off. They all hit the bottom of the pond. As they know the net is coming after them.
    I have a ogon that always stays deep.
    Until feed time.
    But it is always swimming about on the bottom. Not just sitting there.
    Fred

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  15. #188
    Senior Member Rank = Mature Champion RS2OOO's Avatar
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    Cheers Fred.

    I agree. Have a couple of fish that are less tame since scraping them. You can get them tame again but it's a lot of work to build trust back. Some don't care and stay tame no matter how many times you catch them.

    The Sanke doesn't really stay sitting for long periods, kind of sits for 5 minutes then drifts forward a few feet and sits again.

    Been watching him from a distance today.

    Over 20 minutes I counted 4 flashes in the big pond, 2 from the Kirin and 2 from others.

    Could be nothing but will scrape this evening just to put mind at rest.

    The baby koi pond is attached to the main pond and water often splashes between the 2 so chance of contamination is high and I'm certain the babies had flukes due to the rapid improvement after treating.

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    Last edited by RS2OOO; 25-08-2019 at 12:40 PM.

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  17. #189
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Grand Champion john1's Avatar
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    Did you do your scrapes Rs?

    Just wondered if you found anything.
    John

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  19. #190
    Senior Member Rank = Mature Champion RS2OOO's Avatar
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    Scraped 3 Koi.

    Couldn't get hardly any mucus off the big Sanke, impossible, managed about 1mm2.

    Got tiny amounts of mucus off one, and a good chunk of mucus off the Kirin but it was all collected from the top half of the fish between gill and dorsal fin which I don't think is the best place. How on earth people manage to get it from underneath or near the pectoral fins I don't know! As soon as I tilt the fish slightly they start thrashing about.

    I'm the world's worst koi scraper... so scared of the fish jumping, a nervous wreck.

    Anyway, all the scrapes were clean, nothing found on any.

    Just wish I could take a proper decent scrape every time. With my faffing about I put the Koi through more stress than if I just grabbed them tight and got on with it.

    Happily all 3 still came and hand fed afterwards.... treated them with some mussels, they never turn mussels down no matter how much I've pissed them off.
    Last edited by RS2OOO; 25-08-2019 at 08:53 PM.

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  21. #191
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Jussai bowsaw's Avatar
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    how often do you have to scratch a itch? as above with john1 every one gets a niggle now and again and since the only fish fingers are to be found in a cardboard box, they flash to itch, if its the same one over and over again then id be worried. but the stress of capture etc is not worth it in my opinion for them getting ride of a slight niggle
    the slow pond build thread

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  23. #192
    Senior Member Rank = Mature Champion RS2OOO's Avatar
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    Generally agree bowsaw but the flashing is a little more than occasional so I feel the need to try and establish if the Sanke is just unsociable or genuinely under the weather.

    As mentioned the fry stopped flashing when I treated for flukes and with the contamination between their pond and the adjacent big pond this has been playing on my mind.

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  25. #193
    Senior Member Rank = Mature Champion RS2OOO's Avatar
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    I was planning on opening the pipes up between fry pond and big pond as an easy way to improve filtration in the fry pond.

    They are literally side by side, fry pond around 850 litres when full, main pond currently around 11,150 litres.

    Double checked the temps of each and the fry pond which is 50% shaded was at 26C and the main pond which is in full sun at 22.5C. Was quite surprised at that.

    So I've set it up so the main pond is dripping into the fry pond which will hopefully match the temps within a few days.

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  27. #194
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Jussai bowsaw's Avatar
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    in a few days time when the air temp in the shade is due to lose 10c the small pool will quickly chill down and larger one will hold its heat so they should be close to each other
    the slow pond build thread

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  29. #195
    Quote Originally Posted by RS2OOO View Post
    Scraped 3 Koi.

    Couldn't get hardly any mucus off the big Sanke, impossible, managed about 1mm2.

    Got tiny amounts of mucus off one, and a good chunk of mucus off the Kirin but it was all collected from the top half of the fish between gill and dorsal fin which I don't think is the best place. How on earth people manage to get it from underneath or near the pectoral fins I don't know! As soon as I tilt the fish slightly they start thrashing about.

    I'm the world's worst koi scraper... so scared of the fish jumping, a nervous wreck.

    Anyway, all the scrapes were clean, nothing found on any.

    Just wish I could take a proper decent scrape every time. With my faffing about I put the Koi through more stress than if I just grabbed them tight and got on with it.

    Happily all 3 still came and hand fed afterwards.... treated them with some mussels, they never turn mussels down no matter how much I've pissed them off.
    If you look at some videos. Some of these
    Vet people put them to sleep. To get good all round scrapes. I have nt personally done it myself. But I have seen videos of it.

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  31. #196
    Good to hear there is nothing there on the scrapes. RS. Now they don t need to be put through treatment. And guessing what they may have.
    Just a thought could the flashing be because of temps going up and down.
    Like this heatwave now. And they don t like the jumps in temperature up and down.
    Like Bowsaw says could just be they want a little scratch.
    But you know your fish. I know myself when something ain't right.
    And it does my head in when I can t find it.
    I had a problem with my fish once.
    They was leaping and flashing that bad.
    That they where developing ulcers.
    So I started to play about with things to eliminate the cause.
    It turned out. I had put my air on a timer. And they did nt like the change. As soon as I kept the air running continuously they stopped flashing.
    Unbelievable I know. But if I go out now and play with my air sauce they go nuts.
    It's only the koi though. My other fish don't
    Get bothered by anything.
    It facinates me sometimes how koi are more sensitive to changes.
    Fred


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  33. #197
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Grand Champion john1's Avatar
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    Was thinking the same as Fred,maybe use a mild dose of sedative to make them dosey so you can scrape the Sanke easier,or get someone to help you hold them but I think that stresses them more useing force.

    Are you dechlorinating ok Rs?
    John

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  35. #198
    Quote Originally Posted by john1 View Post
    Was thinking the same as Fred,maybe use a mild dose of sedative to make them dosey so you can scrape the Sanke easier,or get someone to help you hold them but I think that stresses them more useing force.

    Are you dechlorinating ok Rs?
    Was thinking that on the next step of eliminations John.

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  37. #199
    Senior Member Rank = Mature Champion RS2OOO's Avatar
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    Thanks fellas for the suggestions, could be right about temps.... The fry pond was at 26 yesterday and this morning it's only 22.5

    The big pond doesn't fluctuate like that and it's still 22 but it does sometimes move a couple of degrees over 24 hours.

    About dechlorination, I've been baffled lately that the pond level keeps rising even without rain. It has gone up another 3 or 4mm since last night and it's struck me that it must be the Draco. Some of the water from the jets must be missing the waste tray. It's cleaning every 9 minutes over the last 3 days so that's a lot of cleaning. Obviously that water isn't dechlorinated. I don't think chlorine is a problem though as I put enough ST crystals in to be sure even though the water changes are via the purifier.

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  39. #200
    Senior Member Rank = Mature Champion RS2OOO's Avatar
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    How are your fry John, do they still flash?

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