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  1. #21
    Moderator Rank = Supreme Champion Feline's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by familyman View Post
    ive got 2 water pumps running, 1 x 175 wph and the other variable but currently running at 160 wph, also 2 x air pumps combined using 150 wph, and a 55 w uv, so 540 wph, plus the drum but I dont even think about that because it only operates for 10 seconds every half hour or so.
    So 540 watts an hour at about 15 p a kilowatt is 13 kilowatts in a 24 hour day, so £1.95 a day.....but ive not included the heat pump yet, which uses 1.2 kilowatts an hour, just dont know how long its on though so very hard to work out.
    On the plus side we have a 16 panel solar system, which they assume you only use half of the energy you make, and so they pay you for the other half...well I know for sure I use all the energy it makes from probably September right through to april, so its like a win , win situation. I think without the solar panels my running costs would be scary, at least through winter.
    That's very interesting. I have seriously considered getting some solar panels. The only thing that's stopped me is that our main roof is west-east facing so is not idea for the panels. One of my double garage roof pitches is south facing but probably not large enough.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Feline View Post
    That's very interesting. I have seriously considered getting some solar panels. The only thing that's stopped me is that our main roof is west-east facing so is not idea for the panels. One of my double garage roof pitches is south facing but probably not large enough.
    depending on foot print? ive got 3.9kw array and created roof space (garden buildings) with space for approx. 12-14kw

    not currently connected up, but will be running my pond 24/7 once I diy build my own lithium 48v lithium iron phosphate lifepo4 battery and BMS next year its something im very clued up on if you need any advice on the matter.

    if you haven't got space for it, not worth doing unless you can utilise hybrid system to include wind and/or hydro
    then choice of grid connected or off grid - generator backup charging (preferred choice) general rule of thumb for off grid is enough stored energy at a given discharged level at 3 days autonomy - im going for 7 days..

    their are hybrid inverters 3kw upwards that now can power appliances without batteries connected and switch/supplement to mains when solar PV /wind ect drops below output power required.

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  4. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by markini5 View Post
    depending on foot print? ive got 3.9kw array and created roof space (garden buildings) with space for approx. 12-14kw

    not currently connected up, but will be running my pond 24/7 once I diy build my own lithium 48v lithium iron phosphate lifepo4 battery and BMS next year its something im very clued up on if you need any advice on the matter.

    if you haven't got space for it, not worth doing unless you can utilise hybrid system to include wind and/or hydro
    then choice of grid connected or off grid - generator backup charging (preferred choice) general rule of thumb for off grid is enough stored energy at a given discharged level at 3 days autonomy - im going for 7 days..

    their are hybrid inverters 3kw upwards that now can power appliances without batteries connected and switch/supplement to mains when solar PV /wind ect drops below output power required.
    This is very interesting subject - we produce about 16 MW of solar power / year on the flat roofs of our house and garage - out of which we can utilize only about 60% each year - while buying from grid another 8 MW - but so far I have not been able to find economically viable energy storage system - capable to store enough energy plus being able to supply it to three different phases as individually needed - it would be great if you may share your ideas for energy storage system you mentioned in your post.

    Our solar installation works with 75 monocrystaline panels / 225 Wp each in three strings and three single phase DC / AC inverters into three phase output - but each phase does have slightly varried output at given day time due to variations in panels orientation caused by costruction constraints back in 2009 when we have installed it. Most of our systems are on electricity - house heating / cooling by 14kW ASHP, which does hot water as well plus all pond and other household equipment.
    You get what you pay for - or better - what you make yourself.

  5. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Feline View Post
    That's very interesting. I have seriously considered getting some solar panels. The only thing that's stopped me is that our main roof is west-east facing so is not idea for the panels. One of my double garage roof pitches is south facing but probably not large enough.
    Lara,

    You may want to invite solar power expert to investigate and calculate best solar system for your roof - it is true, that best yield is from south facing roofs, but I will make possibly provocative statement here - my opinion it is relative to what is the primary objective of your desired system:

    1. If it is purely maximum power output, than yes - South facing surface on Northern hemisphere is the way to go.

    2. If your primary objective may be to secure longest continuous power output from your solar array, than smart installation with East, South and West facing panels will give you precisely this - in single phase setup - each of the three different oriented panel arrays will produce their peak output in different time of the day - giving you longest power supply from morning till evening - but maximum total power output will be lower than if all would face South only - but this would require an expert to evaluate your specific situation and roofs orientation as well as to calculate costs and power output / income potential to generate.

    Just food for thought I guess.....
    You get what you pay for - or better - what you make yourself.

  6. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by milaz View Post
    This is very interesting subject - we produce about 16 MW of solar power / year on the flat roofs of our house and garage - out of which we can utilize only about 60% each year - while buying from grid another 8 MW - but so far I have not been able to find economically viable energy storage system - capable to store enough energy plus being able to supply it to three different phases as individually needed - it would be great if you may share your ideas for energy storage system you mentioned in your post.

    Our solar installation works with 75 monocrystaline panels / 225 Wp each in three strings and three single phase DC / AC inverters into three phase output - but each phase does have slightly varried output at given day time due to variations in panels orientation caused by costruction constraints back in 2009 when we have installed it. Most of our systems are on electricity - house heating / cooling by 14kW ASHP, which does hot water as well plus all pond and other household equipment.
    ive been DIYing renewables for past 15 years, which is obviously cheapest method and quickest way to learn.
    75 panels wow, I guy I brought a 5kw inverter from has 100 250w panels , totally off grid.

    mine are linked in series strings of 3 peak 98volts
    275w JA polycrystalline panels
    1 x 60A 150v in/48v output Morningstar mppt charge controller
    1x 45A SAME.

    not long sold off my batteries I brought used. Rolls surrette series 5000 40kwh 20hr 48v wet lead acid. so I can invest the money into lithium cells.

    its such a huge topic I wouldn't know where to begin.

    various ways, a lot of people on a tight budget risk (not me) tesla powerwall DIY .. using used laptop batteries 18650 lithium cobalt cells 3.6/7v per cells

    3 cells = 12v+ but they are less safe, lower cycle life and not cost effective. though they have a much higher energy density hence their use in modern electric and hybrid cars.. but to gain maximum cycle life , avoid over discharging and over charging .

    lithium iron phosphate , are very safe, far greater life cycles , but lower energy density . costs are roughly the same per AH
    but require 4 cells for 12v as nominal voltage is lower 3.2v

    best place is china direct from manufacturers, but be very careful who to choose and how you pay.. , do your research on type, size, configuration that best suits the space you have and the demands you will place on the batteries.

    trial order first, run tests on the cells .

    you would benefit from upgrading to single 3phase inverter with multiple mppt inputs.
    their are hybrid 3 phase inverters that utilise HV storage batteries most commonly used in factories than homes.

    despite having a trade account with several solar suppliers in the UK, batteries are still too expensive in the UK.
    sadly our government has interests in fossil fuels - fracking being a prime example and ditched renewables , other big economies have kept to reducing CO2 by giving huge discounts on electric cars, charging stations, solar, wind ect. here we get no help other than a feed in tariff that has been rolled back over time making it less worth it..
    you would expect any serious government that claims to want to tackle climate change would at least offer vat free on renewable products ..

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  8. #26
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Supreme Champion john1's Avatar
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    This is a very interesting subject on solar panels and something i know nothing about,can it be explained in simple terms?
    John

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  10. #27
    Senior Member Rank = Grand Champion andikoi's Avatar
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    my answer is dont bother with solar,not now anyway,we got persuaded by all the bumph about how much we would get back and it works out nothing near,ours is financed over i think 6 years and got told it would pay half the cost in returns,they said we would get about £400 a year back from fits,we havent had £200 a year back yet,every year the government lowers the rate on FITS,people that had it installed 10-15 years ago are getting like £700+ a year,we have a 4kw system and yes in the spring summer and this autumn it worked well but winter you get nothing really,plus you have to phone evry 3 months to give them a reading then they can take upto 28 days to pay you,if you have a system that generates enough even on bad days then fine,but you would need a lot of panels,and most dont have the room,lara you can have free standing panels if you have the floor space,andi

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  12. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by markini5 View Post

    despite having a trade account with several solar suppliers in the UK, batteries are still too expensive in the UK.
    sadly our government has interests in fossil fuels - fracking being a prime example and ditched renewables , other big economies have kept to reducing CO2 by giving huge discounts on electric cars, charging stations, solar, wind ect. here we get no help other than a feed in tariff that has been rolled back over time making it less worth it..
    you would expect any serious government that claims to want to tackle climate change would at least offer vat free on renewable products ..

    Completely agree with you on this - it’s a crying shame really

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  14. #29
    Moderator Rank = Supreme Champion Feline's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by andikoi View Post
    my answer is dont bother with solar,not now anyway,we got persuaded by all the bumph about how much we would get back and it works out nothing near,ours is financed over i think 6 years and got told it would pay half the cost in returns,they said we would get about £400 a year back from fits,we havent had £200 a year back yet,every year the government lowers the rate on FITS,people that had it installed 10-15 years ago are getting like £700+ a year,we have a 4kw system and yes in the spring summer and this autumn it worked well but winter you get nothing really,plus you have to phone evry 3 months to give them a reading then they can take upto 28 days to pay you,if you have a system that generates enough even on bad days then fine,but you would need a lot of panels,and most dont have the room,lara you can have free standing panels if you have the floor space,andi
    A nice idea Andi, but I definitely don't have floor space- the garden is all taken up by pond and a lawn for the chickens
    My filter house roof is in full sun all day, but I didn't build it to take that kind of weight, plus it's not all that big.

    I think if I did go for solar it wouldn't really be for money saving reasons- it would be environmental. My partners family owned a wind turbine business and so he is very into greener energy sources. My pond is far from green really especially if you take into account all the cement I used in the construction process

  15. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by andikoi View Post
    my answer is dont bother with solar,not now anyway,we got persuaded by all the bumph about how much we would get back and it works out nothing near,ours is financed over i think 6 years and got told it would pay half the cost in returns,they said we would get about £400 a year back from fits,we havent had £200 a year back yet,every year the government lowers the rate on FITS,people that had it installed 10-15 years ago are getting like £700+ a year,we have a 4kw system and yes in the spring summer and this autumn it worked well but winter you get nothing really,plus you have to phone evry 3 months to give them a reading then they can take upto 28 days to pay you,if you have a system that generates enough even on bad days then fine,but you would need a lot of panels,and most dont have the room,lara you can have free standing panels if you have the floor space,andi
    sadly we have a government that does care about climate change - that's the truth
    from Andi's point of view its about payback for feed in which is pretty unless you've got a solar farm
    plus the costs upfront for a professional to install with4kw system costing around £4000 installed but your fixed to the grid and the benefits are mostly made by national grid not the owner . reason being most of us use no energy during 9 - 5 because of work when the system is producing its power.
    the feed in tariff when introduced gradually became a big reason to install, but government is lobbied/donors by energy companies.

    only way is off grid and DIY installed .

    another hobby of mine is wood working, from my workshop shed before I installed solar /batteries it was costing nearly £10 a week in electric running dust extraction , table saws, mitre saws, routers , lighting, wifi, laptop,
    when I installed solar pv and 40kwh storage my bill went to zero only in the worst of winter dark days did I use mains which was for 9 days total rest of year I was completely off grid using stored energy .

    in just over 2 years all of the costs were paid back that I invested.

    next year im building a 40kwh lithium storage battery which can be discharged much deeper without any damage to battery (psoc) adding another 3 - 5kwh PV upgrading my inverter to take charging amps up to 300Amps at 48v the latter has a huge impact on lithium batteries as a break in the clouds even for a short period of an hour can almost fully charge certain lithium batteries from near fully discharged .
    then I can run my pond off grid as well ..

    I making a 2 metre tall VAWT in the new year that will add around 500w

 

 
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