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Thread: Heated trickle feed
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02-09-2018, 08:43 PM #1
Heated trickle feed
Hi.
I have just added a new trickle feed from my house to the pond to enable me to run soft water rather than very hard water via a water softener. Not RO I know but I'm giving it a go. I have an opportunity to mix this trickle feed with a warm water supply and was wondering if this is safe for the koi. I have an ASHP but thought I might keep a 15C trickle feed in through the winter. It may even be cheaper? It certainly might be useful for prolonged periods of very low temps as a back up.
Any thoughts appreciated.
thanks.
ian
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02-09-2018, 09:00 PM #2
I think it is good idea a constant trickle of hot water for top up.
Is water softener 100% ok for Koi?
Alex
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02-09-2018, 09:24 PM #3
Hi Alex,
i understood it it was and that forum member JohnKitching does this (where I got the idea from). GH is down in source water from 22 to 2. Softener replaces calcium and magnesium for sodium ions.
Maybe JohnKitching / MankySanke can enlighten here.
Thanks.
ian
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03-09-2018, 07:02 AM #4
Can you still use the pond water on the garden?
Currently we pump from our pond straight onto the lawn and garden.
Alex
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03-09-2018, 07:05 AM #5
Hi Alex. Not sure as have read not to use soft water via softener on plants. There is a lot of conflicting info out there re this. I am confident koi will be okay however as others use this approach.
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03-09-2018, 08:10 AM #6
I think you need to be careful if you ever buy smaller fish, I think John found that tosai would die in the high sodium water.
I personally would not do this as I would be very worried about long term load on their kidneys having to excrete all that extra sodium. But youre right that there are people out there doing it (not sure over how long a time period though).
How long a pipe run will your trickle be going over?
I’m not sure the water would still be warm by the time it got to the other end at slow flow rates unless you installed monstrous lagging to it.
When I first qualified as a vet we all used to warm up bags of IV fluids to body temperature. But then someone actually tested the temperature that was coming out of the line at the patient end and found that it made absolutely no difference whether you warmed the bag or not. These days we dont warm them, but if we want the patient to get warmed fluids we run the line through a heated bath close to the patient instead.
It could help stop your trickle feed freezing though particularly if you have a bit that isn't below ground as it leaves the house.2016 new 6000 gallon pond
https://www.koiforum.uk/pond-construc...ghlight=feline
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imc28 Thanked / Liked this Post
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03-09-2018, 03:43 PM #7
Thanks Lara.
I have done some reading around this but as ever, there's always conflicting advice. I share your concern re possible effects on koi physiology etc but I am open minded so will try for a while and monitor koi closely. I have no Tosai. All koi are three years plus. The key might be understanding the concentration of sodium ions fed into the pond and then at what levels are these safe/not safe. Given you practice vetinary science, I am definitely listening as the last thing I want to do is harm my koi.
I have two feeds to the pond now. My hard water supply Gh 22 and now this soft water supply GH 2. Ph and Kh remain at 7.4 and 16 respectively. I can also mix the hard and soft water which may be an option? If I end up turning off the soft water feed, this is not an issue.
My aim is to install RO but I'm not quite there yet. I do like JohnKitching's thinking re benefits of low Gh but with ph stability. Not at the expense of koi health of course.
I intend to monitor salt levels if I can find the right piece of kit at a reasonable price.
Thank you for your advice.
ian.
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03-09-2018, 03:58 PM #8
Heated trickle feed
I’ve had a softener running for almost a year; I have Tosai, Nisai and Sansai and not had a problem. Make sure your using the ‘pure’ salt and not something with a caking agent or anything else added.
Not saying it’ll work for everyone but I’ve had no issues. For interest there are a fair few people on the various Facebook Groups running softeners (Passion For Koi/Rasta).
I don’t know if John still frequents the Forum, not heard from him in ages!
Rob.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ProLast edited by RJW2012; 03-09-2018 at 04:03 PM.
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03-09-2018, 04:24 PM #9
Thanks Rob. That's reassuring. I'm also on the said forums.
I have just just found a salt free softener for c. £500 that looks interesting. Maybe one for the future?
https://www.uk-water-filters.co.uk/t...softeners.html
Unfortunately, sodium ion meters look really expensive so unlikely to be able to monitor.
Ian
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03-09-2018, 04:28 PM #10
Yep, I don’t monitor mine to be honest and like John, I use a system from Harvey’s.
The unit tells you when it needs filling up and you simply drop in two big blocks of salt which last a few weeks (depends on how much water your using of-course).
Rob.
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03-09-2018, 04:50 PM #11
Hi Rob. My softener is the same. My reasoning behind buying a sodium ion meter was to monitor the sodium ion concentration in soft water and pond compared to hard water and whether this was below the acceptable safe limit of 200mg/l (my assumption being if below safe level for humans, then hopefully okay for koi to?).
Really just thinking about Lara's comment re potential impact on kidney function as this could take many years to manifest itself I assume.
ian
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03-09-2018, 06:22 PM #12
Be interested in results Ian...
Rob.
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03-09-2018, 07:10 PM #13
I wonder if sending water away for a sodium ion test would be an option. Im sure all the big commercial labs could offer it, but no idea how much it would cost.
Im tempted to run a sample of pond water through my blood electrolyte machine at work to see if it would get a reading. It would need to be in the readable range of the gadget so possibly not.2016 new 6000 gallon pond
https://www.koiforum.uk/pond-construc...ghlight=feline
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04-09-2018, 01:50 PM #14
Hi Lara,
Good point. I had also thought about this. Will look into it but my gut feel is expensive. I'll share what I find.
Ian.
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04-09-2018, 08:28 PM #15
Hi again Lara,
I have found somewhere that will test for sodium ions for £100, which is the minimum lab charge. A portable meter costs £300 to £400.
if I do this I am assuming I'll just need to test the output from the water softener once and also the pond water. Plan to wait until I know the pond transition between hard and soft water is complete, so may do in New Year.
I'll share results.
ian.
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pug has a very impressive veg filter on his pond, have a look at some of his his youtube videos....