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  1. #1

    I want koi without humps. Which breeders/farms should I buy from?

    I was told that the Matusunosuke (Yamamatsu) koi farm fish tend to not have humps. Are there other bloodlines that you know of that do not express the shoulder hump?

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I see a greater frequency of shoulder humps among Japanese koi vs non Japanese.

    Also a side question, when you visit a farm or breeder, could you possibly request to see fish that have no humps? Those that have a smooth transition from head to shoulder when viewed side view?



  2. #2
    Moderator Rank = Supreme Champion Feline's Avatar
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    You can ask the dealer to bowl up some fish you like the body shape of anywhere.

    I have sleek slinky fish and fat fish like jumbo jets from exactly the same breeders and blood lines. A bit like my sister is fatter than me and from the same parent stock

    Some Japanese breeders go for body shapes that initially grow more slowly but keep their shape- I believe Takigawa is one of those and my Takigawa Kohaku certainly has a very nice body shape with lots of growth potential.

    If you want to learn about characteristics of blood lines then a visit to the National koi show next wweekend would be a good place to start. Yume koi have a stand there and Mike is an expert on koi body shape and potential.

    You could also join an organised buying group trip to Japan to select fish with the help of an expert if your budget allows.

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  4. #3
    Senior Member Rank = Gosai Brandlin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Feline View Post
    I have sleek slinky fish and fat fish like jumbo jets from exactly the same breeders and blood lines. A bit like my sister is fatter than me and from the same parent stock
    There are a number of reasons I like this forum. Humour is one of them!



    (Oh, and I'm learning loads about fish too!)

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  6. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Feline View Post
    You can ask the dealer to bowl up some fish you like the body shape of anywhere.

    I have sleek slinky fish and fat fish like jumbo jets from exactly the same breeders and blood lines. A bit like my sister is fatter than me and from the same parent stock

    Some Japanese breeders go for body shapes that initially grow more slowly but keep their shape- I believe Takigawa is one of those and my Takigawa Kohaku certainly has a very nice body shape with lots of growth potential.

    If you want to learn about characteristics of blood lines then a visit to the National koi show next wweekend would be a good place to start. Yume koi have a stand there and Mike is an expert on koi body shape and potential.

    You could also join an organised buying group trip to Japan to select fish with the help of an expert if your budget allows.
    Thanks for the info! My concern would be that possibly the koi farms have already culled those without humps? Also when I see koi shows, literally all of them have humps so large that they can be seen from top view.

    I have no idea whether or not bloodlines really affect the koi body shape, as for me they all look the same. Those for show all have humps and when viewed from the side, they look bloated and improportional to the body (maybe overfed). Japanese show koi all have beautiful colors but their body shapes can sometimes get hideous.

    As you were mentioning Takigawa, their bloodlines has less humps?

  7. #5
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Jussai RJW2012's Avatar
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    I want koi without humps. Which breeders/farms should I buy from?

    The hump (shoulders) is desirable for most hobbyists; fits into the ‘good body shape’ category; genetics, skeleton and bone structure related.

    As you say it is a personal thing really, you like it or not. The head shape/size plays a part here, I.e. the smaller the head the larger the shoulders seem. It is muscle as far as I’m aware also, so not a fatty deposit from over feeding.

    Rob.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

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  9. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by RJW2012 View Post
    The hump (shoulders) is desirable for most hobbyists; fits into the ‘good body shape’ category; genetics, skeleton and bone structure related.

    As you say it is a personal thing really, you like it or not. The head shape/size plays a part here, I.e. the smaller the head the larger the shoulders seem. It is muscle as far as I’m aware also, so not a fatty deposit from over feeding.

    Rob.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    Maybe I should request koi fish with larger or longer heads. I really do notice that koi with bigger heads tend not to have humps. However, I rarely see those kinds of fish

    How about you do you prefer humps or no?

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  11. #7
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Jussai RJW2012's Avatar
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    A impressive frame and thus ‘big’ shoulders is something I like, yes.

    Rob.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

  12. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by RJW2012 View Post
    A impressive frame and thus ‘big’ shoulders is something I like, yes.

    Rob.


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    Same here as long as its in keeping with the size of the fish overall - if you don't like them, avoid Jumbo sized, and female koi.

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  14. #9
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Jussai RJW2012's Avatar
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    I want koi without humps. Which breeders/farms should I buy from?

    Well said! My problem is that I am a sucker for a Jumbo Tosai so invariably these fish are big framed.

    Rob.


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    Last edited by RJW2012; 19-06-2018 at 11:11 AM.

 

 

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