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Thread: Koi as a weakened strain of Carp
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25-11-2017, 11:06 PM #1
Koi as a weakened strain of Carp
Its a long shot, but what's the chances that the 'Koi strain of Carp (vibrant colours, vivid contrasts, distinct marcature) could be strengthened through breeding to more resist trial of life?
After all its we humans who created them and we did it because of they're aesthetic characteristics and value, and in so doing we have generated in them a genetic weakness for survival that unless very carefully nurtured in an artificial environment they cannot survive.
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25-11-2017, 11:32 PM #2
There are millions of koi throughout the world living and thriving in lakes and rivers.
In all honesty, I think that they may well survive better in the wild than in our relatively tiny ponds!
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26-11-2017, 10:39 AM #3
There’s a big pond / small lake near me that a farmer put a lot of koi in about 20 years ago.
They survive very well but each generation look less like koi and more like carp.
I have one in my pond that I’d guess is fifth or sixth generation of “wild” koi.
Not a great picture but shows what happens.
I’d say it’s one of my hardier koi.
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freddyboy Thanked / Liked this Post
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26-11-2017, 11:17 AM #4
Thinking about it. I think you might be onto something but maybe for the wrong reason.
If we assume for the sake of argument that wild carp are hardier than koi is that because they have hardier genes or that the fittest survive rather than the prettiest selected?
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freddyboy Thanked / Liked this Post
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26-11-2017, 02:34 PM #5
Fascinating isn't it, its what farmers have been doing for thousands of years, but left to breed randomly everything reverts back to base in time, a carps still a carp and a fish. Its just that on learning about the struggle people are having trying to keep Koi alive in small ponds, I just wondered if a breeding program's going on to try to get the genes mixed in as much as is possible from the huge stock of these animals that are spread around the world to encourage what I think is called (cross breed vigour) that could make them hardier, but then I suppose this might simply turn them back in ordinary carp. That 5th-6th generation carp looks terrific John.
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freddyboy Thanked / Liked this Post
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26-11-2017, 02:39 PM #6
Thanks Loadbragle.
I think you’re right about it kind of being done the same as farmers have been for years. I guess the difference for us is the criteria used when selectively breeding. Not sure how long a farmer would last who selectively bred on how pretty his sheep are (but that’s an entirely different debate )
We’re probably closer to how (non working) dogs have been selectively bred aren’t we? My argument being koi are closer to poodles than Friesians
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freddyboy Thanked / Liked this Post
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26-11-2017, 03:49 PM #7
Haahaa yeah, a hillside covered in Koi coloured sheep would be quite a spectacle though, and could catch on, bringing more people to the countryside, and help the rural economy, imagine a 'Sheep Skin Coat' made from 'Koi sheep' lol
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JohnKitching, freddyboy Thanked / Liked this Post
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26-11-2017, 06:54 PM #8
The bottom line is that Koi have been selectively breed for how they look and not for durability!
Alex
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03-12-2017, 12:04 AM #9
I can tell you've never been to a proper country animal show
In my final year at vet school we were renting a farmhouse and had a herd of belted galloway cattle on the farm. We entered one in the Bath and West and spent the evening shampooing it so it's white stripe was clean and it's legs. Overnight it shat in the stable we had it in and rolled in it and totally stained it's white stripe green. I ended up using a laundry stain bar on it to get it all out in time. it didn't even win a prize lol.2016 new 6000 gallon pond
https://www.koiforum.uk/pond-construc...ghlight=feline
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freddyboy Thanked / Liked this Post
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03-12-2017, 08:29 AM #10
The Daily pond temp thread
Still at around 17C, know what you mean about getting the covers off though :D it will be really...